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  1. #1
    Techno Viking
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    Default B13, B14, B15 Suspension Information...

    Updated Again 10/07/2012

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    There is a lot of misinformation floating around this forum concerning our suspensions. Perhaps this thread will help to dispel some of that erroneous information. I am no expert, I have very limited mechanical knowledge at best. Therefore, I only quote folks with considerable expertise concerning our suspensions. I provide plenty of links, facts, tech information, and expert, professional advice. Think of this as a collegiate level research paper on B13, B14 and B15 suspensions. Every source gets cited, as it should be.

    I continuously keep this thread updated and current with any new offerings or information. Suggestions, corrections, or helping me with pertinent information or relevent photos is welcomed. "XXX" anything currently means I need more information or sources. I will incorporate things as rapidly as possible given my schedule. Typically new items show up every several months or so.

    If you find something I am missing that is pertinent to this thread, then by all means PM me. Or you can post it yourself in this thread, and (assuming you are on track) I will incorporate it into the thread body itself.

    I *clearly* indicate where I may be guessing on a few items.

    I hope you find this enlightening.

    Shawn B


    ___________________________________________

    Appendix:

    I. Overview of the B13, B14, B15 Suspensions
    * What is the differences between the three chassis codes?
    * I want to get the rear beam on my B14, B15 bent.
    * Why our suspensions are not easy to modify correctly.
    * How Stuff Works link for those as ignorant as I am.
    * Mike Kojima Lays The Information Smackdown
    * Mike Kojima at MotoIQ and The Ultimate Guide to Suspension and Handling (at MotoIQ).
    * Handling and Brakes FAQ - What is your chassis telling you?
    * Suspension component diagram and part numbers.
    * Foreign websites, use the N14.

    II. Conventional Struts and Springs
    * Nissan OEM Stock Spring Rates
    * SR20 Forum Exclusive Springs: Hypercoil and Road Magnet
    * Other Springs: B+G, Dropzone, Eibach, H&R, Megan Racing, Progress, Tein, Tokico, Vogtland...
    * KYB AGX struts
    * Custom Shortened Koni's (abreviated to CSK's in this thread)
    * Other struts...Tokico Blue, etc....
    * Bumpstops
    * Strut Boots
    * Strut Mounts...OEM, Upgraded OEM, Motivational

    III. Coilover systems
    * Advance Design and Ground Control
    * B+G
    * Bits N Peices
    * Hot Bits
    * Ksport (or D2's)
    * Motivational Engineering
    * Progress
    * Shigspeed
    * Shocktek
    * Tein

    IV. Bushings
    * Energy Suspension - Downsides, "suspension bind", and do you really need them?
    * Superpro
    * Whiteline
    * Spherical metal bushings

    V. Braces
    * 2-Point FSTB options: Cusco, Courtesy, E-Bay, Nismo, Stillen, Whiteline
    * Triangulated FSTB : Nothing off the shelf.
    * 2-Point RSTB options: Active Tuning, Bolt In Bars, Cusco, Whiteline
    * Triangulated RSTB options: Bolt In Bars
    * IKEA brace
    * Blehmco lower control arm brace
    * NuTech lower control arm brace
    * Progress lower control arm brace
    * Whiteline lower control arm brace
    * Traction bars
    * Fender braces - Stephens Fender Braces
    * Foam filling the chassis
    * Roll Bars and Roll Cages
    * Harness Bars

    VI. Sway Bars
    * What the hell is a sway bar?
    * Nissan OEM Stock Sway Bars
    * Intrax
    * Nismo
    * NuTech
    * Progress
    * Suspension Techniques
    * Whiteline

    VII. Camber Kits
    * What is camber?
    * Camber bolts or "crash bolts"
    * Cusco
    * Ground Control
    * Ingalls
    * Stillen

    VIII. A Few Words About Wheels & Tires
    * How unsprung weight affects your car.
    * How to do your own alignment.
    * How are wheel width and diameter measured?
    * Conversion Tables for Rims and Tires.
    * What size wheels and tires should I buy?
    * Where should I buy tires?
    * How old are my tires, even when new?
    * Stock OEM wheel information for the B13 and B14.
    * How much tire and wheel can I stuff under my vehicle?
    * Which tires are SR20-Forum Members running on their street or track cars, and what is their opinion on the tires?
    * Upgrading your wheel studs and lug nuts
    * Why in the hell are B14 OEM SE-R rims so damn popular on B13's?

    XI. Limited Slip Differentials
    * What is an LSD?
    * JGY
    * Nismo
    * Nissan OEM
    * Phantom Grip
    * Quaife

    X. Glossary of Suspension Terms
    * Websites and links.

    XI. Recommended Suspension Set-ups
    A half-dozen basic recommended set-ups.
    * What OEM parts do I need to replace?
    * Daily Driver
    * Daily Driver plus auto-cross/HPDE.
    * Serious Racing? Never. You guys on on your own, you already know more than me. Uh....go look at the coilover section and leave me alone.

    XII. Discouraged Suspension Set-up
    * Slamming your car as low as possible, while re-engineering it correctly.


    _________________________________________

    I. OVERVIEW

    What is the differences between the three chassis codes?

    The B13 suspension is comprised of an independent McPherson strut suspension in both the front and rear.

    The B14 and B15 suspension is comprised of an independent McPherson strut suspension in the front, and a solid rear beam.

    Quote Originally Posted by Choaderboy2
    The B13/B14 front suspension is virtually identical. The B14 rear suspension works but has some inherent flaws, mostly a super high roll center. B14's require beam bending and a lot of rear roll stiffness to work.

    When sussed out, B14's handle pretty good.
    98sr20ve drops knowledge on the B13 vs. B14 rear suspension:
    B13 vs B14 handling - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    Beam= no bump steer, no toe adjustment stock, both tires always even with the road on smooth surface.
    B13 IRS= bump steer, ability to follow the independent movement with both wheels, stock toe adjustment.

    If you want a sweeping and overly simplified generality....

    1) B13 better unless you can get the rear beam bent
    2) B13 better slower speeds/b14 better fast speeds with a bent beam
    3) B13 easier to setup for most people.
    4) B13 better unless you can get the rear beam bent and then refer back to #2
    I want to get the rear beam on my B14, B15 bent.
    98sr20ve (Steve) drops knowledge on bending the rear beam on a B14 to vastly improve the handling:
    How to make your B14 handle properly! - SR20 Forum

    Why our suspensions are not easy to modify correctly.

    Everyone wants to put a performance suspension on their car. It is a terrific first mod that paves the way for future modding. Going fast in a straight line is not nearly as fun as negotiating the curves. Having a ton of power is no good if you end up in a ditch. A performance suspension invariably includes a drop of some sort, and let's be honest, our cars look better a little lower than stock.

    Lowering your B13/14/15 is a slightly tricky endevour. You cannot just "slam" a B13/14/15 on any old springs and struts and expect it to work correctly. The OEM B13/14/15 chassis has three (3) inches of suspension travel. When you start lowering the car, you can easily run out of suspension travel. Running out of suspension travel means bottoming out your struts, slamming off your bumpstops, possibly damaging the struts and/or losing control of your vehicle. Not exactly what you were looking for when you decided to buy a new performance suspension.

    From: Sticky on Sentra Lowering Springs! - NissanForums.com, this is what Mike Kojima has to say:

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kojima
    A question that comes up every day thats annoying is lowering springs for the B13 and B14 Sentras.

    These cars have very little wheel travel and cannot be lowered more than 1-1.5" without badly affecting the ride and handling. H&R spring are way too low and too soft, so are Eibach sportlines and even the less low prokits.

    Get these only if you are into looks, the car will ride the snubbers in a turn and handle poorly. B14's have so little rear wheel travel that they will ride very bad as well. This is a rice mod.

    The only lowering springs that are any good for B13 and B14's are the hypercos and they must be teamed up with a decent shock like a KYB AGX. They have decent spring rates and will really turn your car into a G machine.

    Eibachs and H&R's will work well only when using Motivationals shortend struts and shocks for conventional shaped springs with Motivational/koni foam bumpstops and the Motivational rear shock mount for B14's. These will let you get your wheel travel back and even give a real nice ride.

    Anyone asking these question over and over can now get flamed!

    Mike
    More of Mikes wisdom from:
    NissanPerformanceMag.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kojima, Nissan Performance Magazine
    Article: Project Racer Suspension Upgrades

    The NX has an independent McPherson strut suspension on all 4 corners. While this is a good thing, the NX suffers from a lack of wheel travel. When a car rolls in a turn, the suspension travel on the outside wheels is gobbled up by the roll. If the suspension bottoms out under roll, the spring rate will effectively become infinite and a disproportionate amount of weight will get transferred to that end of the car causing the tires to run at a large slip angle. This will cause the car to immediately slide at the end of the chassis that bottoms out first. This situation is so bad that trying to lower an NX/Sentra much more than 1" will result in bottoming under roll with any sort of reasonable spring rate.

    Lowering a car to reduce the height of the center of gravity is one of the main things you can do to reduce weight transfer across that chassis to help keep load on all 4 wheels when cornering. Unfortunately the B13 platform does not tolerate lowering. So what can one do when building a race version of the car where we want to lower it at least 2 inch? The answer is a shortened strut. If the car is lowered by 2" and the strut is also shortened by the same amount, the center of gravity height can be significantly reduced while maintaining travel. This is the only way to really get a Sentra/NX of this era to handle well no matter what you have been told.
    Sport Compact Car had this to say:
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car July 2000
    Most people, no matter what we tell them to do, buy springs when they want to lower their car, but they don't change the shocks. At the same time, as shocks wear out, many people replace their worn-out shocks with stiffer aftermarket shocks without changing the springs. What this means is that aftermarket springs tend to be low, but not particularly stiff. If they were as stiff as they need to be to keep the suspension from bottoming out, they would be too stiff for stock shocks and, in most cases, even too stiff for off-the-shelf aftermarket shocks. The aftermarket shocks, of course, are too soft because people might use them with stock springs. Oh, the horror.

    Componding this problem is the fact that Nissan almost always builds its cars with insufficient compression travel in the front suspension, so lowering the car means putting it perilously close to the bumpstops at all times....

    With the SE-R, it seems, simple bolt on suspension work isn't going to cut it. So what's the solution?

    Obviously the springs need to be stiffer to keep the shocks from bottoming out. The shocks also have to be stiffer to control the stronger springs. But above all, we need more compression travel. There are two ways to increase compression travel. First, the strut can be redesigned with a shorter shaft. This will increase compression travel and decrease droop travel. The other option for increased compression travel is to simply raise the upper mounting poinit of the front strut - a solution that would seem to involve major re-engineering of the body. (Author not credited)
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car April 2005
    The B13 Sentra's fundamental suspension issue is travel. There isn't much of it. Lowering a B13 with conventional lowering springs has always led to disaster. Inevitably, the springs were designed to lower the car enough to please rice boys and were made soft enough for a cushy ride when paired with stock struts. This is the standard formula for aftermarket lowering springs and the reason we almost never put them on our project cars. Low and soft always gives you a bump stop-thumping street machine. (Author Dave Coleman)
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car July 2005
    If the Classic has a fault anywhere, it's in the old chassis' suspension. In stock form, the B13 has little travel and horrible geometry. (Author Mike Kojima)
    Nissan Performance Magazine from this link: NissanPerformanceMag.com
    Quote Originally Posted by Nissan Performance Magazine
    The largest obstacle to tackle then was the lack of suspension travel on our B13 chassis. Most lowering springs have soft spring rates and they also reduce your amount of suspension travel. So, even though you're looking good, every time you hit a pothole or sudden change in the road surface you have to crank the wheel like a driver in a drift video. The really trick suspension setups correct this problem by using a shortened shock/strut body to increase the available amount of wheel travel. With these setups you can still lower your car for looks but more importantly improve your ride quality and handling characteristics. (Author Aaron Labeau)
    How Stuff Works - Howstuffworks "How Car Suspensions Work"
    This is for those, like me, that are mechanically ignorant. This link covers the basics of a modern suspension in general. Click and be enlightened.

    Mike Kojima Lays The Information Smackdown - This is so good it is flat-out stunning: sentra.net

    NOTE: Understand that some information contained in that link is...dated. This article was written by Mike before Hyperco, let alone Road Magnet springs. Before half the coilovers in that section of this thread even existed. You have to view some of the information, specifically on commercially available springs (H&R, Eibach) and products (NuTech is out of business), in that article with a historical perspective. However, all of the rest of the info is dead accurate today, still completely relevant, and it's freakin' brilliant. Read it all, twice.

    Mike Kojima currently hangs his hat at MotoIQ: Superblackz and BenFenner brought these links to my attention. Brilliant stuff. You should read all of these articles.

    I swiped the following information directly from Ben's Forum Manifesto global sticky.

    The Ultimate guide to Suspension and Handling (MotoIQ)


    Handling and Brakes FAQ - What is your chassis telling you? This information provided by Kyle is brilliant stuff. Read it, be enlightened.

    http://www.sr20-forum.com/informatio...lling-you.html

    B13 Suspension Components diagram and part numbers:

    B13 Suspension Diagram with Part numbers - SR20 Forum

    Cross reference the N14 against B13 products. Check with your supplier.
    Quote Originally Posted by hpro123
    And as in ALL "foreign" companies, check applications for N14 as well. They are identical. Some RNN14 are also identical, others are not.
    Last edited by Shawn B; 10-07-12 at 08:17 PM.
     

  2. #2
    Techno Viking
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    Location: Louisiana
    Posts: 3,513
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    Default

    II. Conventional Struts and Springs

    A quick refresher on how struts and springs interact, from this link: nissanperformancemag.com
    Quote Originally Posted by Nissan Performance Magazine
    In pursuit of a little suspension overview there are some simple concepts to grasp. The spring in your suspension is what absorbs the impacts taken by the vehicle; the shock (or dampener) dampens these motions controlling the oscillation of the spring. The load of the vehicle and amount the suspension will travel is determined by the spring. The shock controls the spring by converting the energy to heat. Heat is generated by the piston speed inside the shock by working the hydraulic oil (and in some cases nitrogen gas) inside the shock.(Author Aaron Labeau)
    Onward.....

    Nissan OEM Stock Spring Rates - G. Wellwood used to (still does?) write for Nissan Performance Magazine. I have quoted him before, expertise confirmed. This thread, courtesy of jrmnet, provides some kick-ass general information:
    Moved to www.gwellwood.com
    Quote Originally Posted by G Wellwood
    OEM-Style Spring Rates
    Front Rate Rear Rate Front Drop Rear Drop

    * Eibach Pro Kit 148.5 68.5-159.9 1.20 1.20"
    * Eibach Sportline 148.5 90.5-142.8 1.60 1.50"
    * Hyperco Gen1 110-180 75-174 1.40 1.25"
    * Hyperco Gen2 110-290 75-200 1.00 1.00"
    * Progress Group 165 140 1.70 1.70"
    * Suspension Techniques 133-175 91-150 1.50 1.50"
    * Tokico 156 152 1.25 1.25"
    * GA16DE Sentra E 112 101
    * GA16DE Sentra XE, GXE 112 90
    * SR20DE Sentra SE-R 123 112
    B14 - XXXXX (hmmmmm.....searching is in my future.)

    B15 - This thread, from B15sentra.net is great information for the B15 chassis. It is a sticky, and from what I can tell, this guy knows his stuff.

    Spring Rates Rundown (Stock and Aftermarket) - B15sentra.net - Nissan Sentra Forum
    Thank you RobSE for bringing this to my attention.

    SR20Forum Exclusive Springs To include Hypercoil (Hyperco) and Road Magnet springs.

    What is the difference between Hyperco and Road Magnet springs? Uh...I cannot believe I am quoting myself, thee first and only time so far, but I state the difference right here:
    Road Magnet springs round 2, B13 & B14 - Page 18 - SR20 Forum

    Now you know the difference, here is the rest of the particulars on the SR20Forum Exclusive springs.

    Hyperco Springs (Hypercoil) - Welcome to Hyperco (Applications: B13 and B14 only)
    Hypercoil is a manufacturer that specializes in racing springs and custom springs for high end tuners (Hennessy, etc.) Some of the brighter suspension minds on the forum, including Chriscar and Choaderboy2, were trying to get a spring manufactured specifically for our B13 platform. A spring that could be used with an OEM length or shortened strut. A versatile spring comfortable enough for a (firm) daily driver, stiff enough to stay off the bumpstops, affording a slight drop (1" both front and back), and good for fairly serious auto-cross or road racing (not street racing, duh.) After much trial and tribulation the Hyperco Gen II spring was born. It is a brilliant design and execution, and is the brain child of the Hyperco Engineers and our very own forum brainiacs.

    You want Hyperco Gen II's. The Hyperco Gen I's were...too low and too soft. Long story, they got redesigned. The Hyperco Gen I' s (purchased pre-owned) would work well with CSK's for a nice daily driver.

    B13 Hyperco Gen I
    Drop: 1.40 front, 1.25" rear
    Struts to use: CSK's only, no OEM length struts.
    Spring rate: 110-180 front, 75-174 rear, progressive rate
    Price: Long discontinued.

    B13 Hyperco Gen II
    Drop: 1" front and rear
    Struts to use: AGX's or better yet CSK's.
    Spring rate: 110-290 front, 75-200 rear, progressive rate
    Ballpark price per set: $330.00 new and they don't depreciate much. If you see them used and want a set, move damned quickly.

    B14 Hyperco
    Drop: 1" front and 5/8" rear
    Struts to use: AGX's or better yet CSK's.
    Spring rate: 110-290 front, 75-200 rear, progressive rate
    Ballpark price per set: $239.00 new and they don't depreciate much. If you see them used and want a set, move damned quickly.

    Viprdude brought to my attention the one (1) and only GB for the B14 Hypercoils back in 2003.
    http://www.sr20forum.com/200sx-se-r/...-deal-its.html

    Hypercoil springs should be installed tight coils up.
    Hyperco tight coil position - SR20 Forum

    Why do they sometimes "clunk" with AGX's? How do I fix it?
    Hypercoil/AGX clunk - SR20 Forum
    Courtesy of Jerryeads, this picture shows the fix:

    And don't worry about the black goo on the springs, that is truck bed liner. Don't ask. Jerry also requested that I stick this information in here:
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerryeads
    btw, you might note (you may have and I missed it) that when they do the hose thing they REALLY ought to take a file and smooth off the bottom(open) end of the Hypercos to fit the recess on the spring seat of the strut. When they clip those things (must be one hell of a pair of tin snips) the tip is pretty sharp; it'll go right through the stock Nissan pad in a heartbeat and probably won't take it too long to wear through the heater hose.
    Thanks Jer.

    What do they look like on the car?
    The Official: Hyperco Drop Thread - SR20 Forum

    How good are Hypercoils, who manufactures them, and why the hell should I pay more for Hypercoil springs on my vehicle? jp314 provides us with an old, but very informative, Hypercoil brochure:
    SR20 Forum

    Nissan Performance Magazine installing Hyperco springs and KYB AGX's on a B14 with happy results. Thanks Sentrixx, much appreciated link.
    nissanperformancemag.com

    (Current 09/2011) Group Buy thread.
    http://www.sr20-forum.com/group-buys...group-buy.html

    Thee only way to buy them is through a Group Buy headed by Chriscar as above. If you miss the most current GB, you might try the Classifieds. Expect them to be pricey and sell very quickly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chriscar from closed Group Buy Thread
    I'd like to thank Mike Kojima for helping us with the initial design parameters of these great springs, and for his continued support. Mike was kind enough to get a set of B13 Hyperco’s into the hands of Dave Coleman of Sport Compact Car Magazine, which lead to an excellent write-up and review in their April Issue.
    We've probably sold close to 200 sets of these springs by now, and they have gotten almost universal praise. There are many, many reviews of them throughout this forum, and a few minutes of searching will more than likely answer any questions you may have.

    Here’s some info from the previous B13 Hyperco group deals that you may find interesting.......
    ************************************************** *********
    They fit 91-94 SE-R and NX2000's, the spring rate is 300lb front / 200lb rear, with a 1" to 1 ˝" drop and they work like a charm with KYB AGX's, or Koni’s. Don't be put off by the high spring rate, your car will ride and handle better than stock, and WAY better than ProKits! There were many people in the first and second round that happily tossed their ProKits in favor of these springs.
    This is a special order, since Hyperco usually only makes springs for race cars (F1, NASCAR, CART/Indy, IMSA, SCCA Trans-Am, etc), and Hyperco makes them for us only in quantities of 50+, and by special order. Don't miss out!
    If you're not familiar with these springs, please take a look at some of the excellent feedback we've gotten from happy forum members....
    Quote Originally Posted by FastNX
    You just turn and the car goes where you want it, no body lean, no questions asked. You have no idea how fast you’re cornering until you look at the speedometer, then you don’t believe you're eyes. Wild. I don't know how they managed to make a suspension setup that handles so well, yet is so comfortable to drive in. Great job!
    Quote Originally Posted by BlowN_SpecV
    Hyperco Gen 2's are on!! I must say I am VERY impressed. Outstanding product and I love the look!!
    Quote Originally Posted by SERprise In WV
    I finished the install of the new Hypercoil 300/200 springs, and can honestly, flat-out tell you that they are wonderful.
    The ride is firm, but not harsh over bumps. Ride height is about 1 inch lower than stock, and one inch higher than ProKits. Just perfect, IMHO.
    In my opinion, my SE-R feels like a totally different car than it was before. Even though the harshness is gone, the transitional abilities are a step above what ProKits had to offer. The car stays flat and goes where you point it.
    Best *conventional* spring I've ever ridden/driven in any car. Just perfect.
    Quote Originally Posted by Its311Pete
    It's been a few days now and an auto-x since I installed my springs. I also built and installed a rear STB at the same time. My comments are pretty much like everyone else, cornering is much more flat, turn in is crisp, and looks are great also.
    Ride comfort isn't compromised allot, it really isn't that bad, bumps are not harsh, just a little more disturbing than stock. On and off throttle the car moves very little.
    Auto-Xing, With the springs, AGX's and Azenis it was a HUGE change for the better. I was doing things with my car I didn't think was possible. I truly believe with a little more fine tuning I will be as good as a Koni/GC setup on a Classic.
    Quote Originally Posted by Narcotix
    This set really does soak up the big bumps and dips way better than the stock setup. The progressive spring rates seem to really help keep the chassis off of the bumpstops. Braking and accelerating are very much different from the 100,000 mile stock setup. Dive and squat are markedly reduced, and turn in is much sharper than the previous wallowy stock suspension.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadsword
    Excellent springs!! Smooth install, great fitment. No weird noises or anything. Nice blue colour too. Performance: Wow! Had my first auto-x on them last night, and understeer has been reduced hugely- I would say by about 70%. Car is now more prone to throttle oversteer - which is a good thing - much more neutral and predictable handling. The lack of understeer is just awesome. FYI - the springs are on over *stock* dampers... can't wait to fix that!
    http://www.xecu.net/billc1/Hypercoil...mpressions.PDF

    Road Magnet Springs - (Applications: B13 and B14 only) Another SR20Forum exclusive initiated in this case by Robchaos19. This has quickly become a great value in spring choices, true performance at a very affordable price. The first set of springs has been delivered to happy customers, the second Group Buy is underway. Much, much closer in specification to the universally praised Hyperco springs than any other spring on the market.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robchaos19
    The president of the company himself told me that if anyone is not 100% satisfied with these springs, they can get their money back.This spring also comes with a 1 year manufacturers warranty against defects and failure, and they do not require it to be installed by a professional.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bennitto Mallitto, post #35 this thread
    RM/AGX
    RM Group Buy #1 B13 Spring rate: 325 front, 250 rear, linear rate
    RM Group Buy #1 B13 Drop: 1.5" front, 1" rear
    Struts to use: AGX's or better yet CSK's.
    Ballpark price per set: $225.00

    Quote Originally Posted by Robchaos19 via PM
    Has it been mentioned in the suspension thread that on the classic the rear fender lip measures lower then the front and can give the impression that the drop in the rear is a little lower then it really is? That has caused some confusion among a couple people.
    It has been mentioned now sir.
    Quote Originally Posted by BeastieBerge
    It took me an hour and a half to do the entire install.
    The Drop looks good and it rides nice. The springs are stiff. Stiff enough, but not too stiff. Car doesn't lean but my back doesn't hurt when I get out of it. I used to have an SER with an ES master kit, Suspension Techiques sway bars, front and rear strut bars, and a lower control arm brace. My NX's suspension is stock except for the springs. Both had 40 series tires. I'd say my NX handles slightly better than the SER did.
    Quote Originally Posted by Benito Malito
    These are plenty stiff. Exacty as advertised. They are nicer than GC because the noise is eliminated. They are a bit too low, but it looks so good. they are the proper stiffness and it is not at all harsh. They are way better than Eibach sportlines, H&R, and e-bay dogisht springs. This is no imposter spring.

    Hyperco the only one comparable and sit a bit higher. Good luck getting a set for less than $330 shipped. Even used.

    With AGX which is the most common choice they run just fine, even when they bottom out. Which they do when you really kill it. It may dog leg going into gas stations. I get a kick out of this.

    My suspension has a Whiteline lower bar, Cusco upper, and ES on everything except the steering rack. I also has a Nutech rear sway bar, with Shigpseed brace, and the AT rstb. So its pretty stiff for a b13. I have 195/50/15 with 512 ziex falkens. The RM's hold their own with this set-up. I'd buy another set with my next SE-R.

    I recommend grabbing up shortened Koni's for this spring. That would be the hot-shti set-up. Plus the blue will look cool on yellow. I'll know soon for sure.
    Based on the specifications and forum member feedback, these springs are certainly a quality performance alternative and better value than any mass manufactured, off the shelf spring (see "Other Springs" below, all of which are lame). Further, as stated by Benito, with CSK's these springs would undoubtedly be flat-out excellent.

    Closed Group Buy #1 thread:
    Road Magnet AFFORDABLE Custom made Springs. Check this GB out. - SR20 Forum

    CURRENT Group Buy #2 thread:
    Quote Originally Posted by Robchaos19 via PM
    I am slightly amending the drop height in the front for the B13 springs to 1.25" instead of 1.5" and I am also offering B14 springs, but specs have not quite been finalized yet. I will keep you updated on the B14 springs as we work things out. Thanks Rob
    Here's the amendment. Specifications for both the B13 and B14 springs on Group Buy #2.

    RM GBII B13 Spring rate: 325 front, 250 rear
    RM GBII B13 Drop: 1.25" front, 1" rear
    Struts to use: AGX's or better yet CSK's.
    Ballpark price: $225'ish

    RM GBII B14 Spring rate: 325 front, 290 rear
    RM GBII B14 Drop: 1.25" front, 1" Rear
    Struts to use: AGX's or better yet CSK's.
    Ballpark price: $225'ish

    This link takes you to the first page of the CURRENT Group Buy:
    http://sr20forum.com/showthread.php?t=189333

    This link takes you further into the CURRENT Group Buy, to some feedback trickling in.
    Road Magnet springs round 2, B13 & B14 - Page 35 - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by TeKKiE from link above
    Loving these springs paired with the AGX's. That and the Koni bumpstops, and my ride is SO MUCH BETTER. I love how it's stiff, yet not jarring like the other springs were.
    Quote Originally Posted by maximumyin
    Just got the chance to really test this setup on back roads near my house. They are everything and more than I expected them to be coming from stock springs. Huge jump in handling prowess AND comfort level. It feels like the springs were the missing link in making my other suspension bits work at their full potential. Can't wait to AutoX with the new setup. Highly recommended!

    Setup used:
    KYB AGX (Setting 2 in front, 5 in the rear), B13 SE-R front sway, Progress rear sway, eBay front strut brace, Octotat rear strut brace, B14 wheels with Falken Azenis 205/40-15. B14 btw.
    Last edited by Shawn B; 09-10-11 at 03:59 PM.
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  3. #3
    Techno Viking
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    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Louisiana
    Posts: 3,513
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    Other Springs

    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)

    Including but not limited to Eibach (Prokit or Sportline), Dropzone, H&R, Intrax, Megan Racing, Progress, Sprint, Suspension Techniques, Tein H-Techs and S-Techs, Tokico, Vogtland....etc....etc.... Too low and too soft, the entire lot of them. They will not work with OEM length struts worth a damn. After discussions with Steve (98sr20ve) a few of them, as indicated, will work well ("decent" is Steve's exact words) with CSK's (remember, Custom Shortened Koni's) for a daily driver. They may be OK if you have glass smooth roads in your area. You are going against all conventional SR20Forum wisdom if you decide to buy any of these brands. They were not designed properly by the manufacturers.

    Here's a thread that discusses this topic of "Other Springs." Pay attention to the smart folks, 98sr20ve, Chriscar, FastNX, Toolapcfan, and totally ignore me.
    Why is it that nobody can make springs worth a damn? - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by Chriscar
    The reason the Hyperco's are so good is that they spent a sh*tload of engineering time on them. The B13 chassis is a tough one to design for and they actually engineered a spring for it using suggestions from real people here on the forum. It wasn't easy getting the drop that we wanted, while staying with a high rate spring, AND keeping the spring long enough so it wouldn't unseat at full suspension droop. There was allot of back and forth discussions with Hyperco.... it would have been allot easier for them to either reduce the rate, or make more of a drop. But in the end they were able to come up with the right combination of wire diameter, tensile strength, number of turns etc.

    I'd bet dollars to donuts that for the most part, the majority of aftermarket spring manufacturers just plug in the numbers for most cars and pop out a spring without going through any significant real world testing.

    The other thing you need to realize is that Hyperco was basically given a mandate by us to make a 300/200 spring that would work with AGX's or better. What that means is that they didn't need to try and make something that would ride soft and more importantly, wouldn't need to work with stock struts.

    Props to Hyperco for doing such a kickass job on the B13 spring.
    For the SAME approximate amount of money you should go back up and look at the section on Road Magnet Springs, or spend a little more and get Hypercos. Support your Forum and get some damn good springs in the process. Used with stock OEM length stuts, and the spring choices below are, in the immortal words of Mike Kojima...."a rice drop."

    B+G - http://www.b-gsuspension.com/home.shtml
    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)
    All chassis: 1.5" drop front, 1.5" drop rear
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Spring rate: Per B+G sales line: "20% stiffer than stock, progressive rate springs.....blah, blah, blah... Should be used with a shortened strut." No kidding. Bonus points for honesty.
    MSRP: $269.00

    Dropzone - http://www.dropzonesuspension.com/index1.htm
    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)
    All chassis: 2" drop front, 2" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Rate: Spoke to Bob Smith (alias supplied by me, the roving reporter) on the phone. Very nice, good sense of humor, very knowledgable. I pestered him about the drop and spring rate. He would not divulge the spring rates, other than "about 35% stiffer than stock."

    Eibach - http://eibach.com/cgi-bin/htmlos.exe...89135400005520 (Applications: B13, B14, B15)

    *B13 Sportline: 1.6" drop front, 1.5" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Rate: 150 front, 140 rear.
    *B13 Pro Kit: 1.2" drop front, 1.2" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Rate: 150 front, 160 rear.
    Friendly guy, reasonable information I suppose.
    *Note: Both types of Eibach springs for the B13 have been discontinued, they are no longer in production.

    Still available for the B14 and B15:

    B14 Sportline: 1.9" front drop, 1.9" rear drop
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Rate: 150 front, 140 rear
    B14 Pro-Kit: 1.4" front drop, 1.4" rear drop
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Rate: 160 front, 140 rear.

    B15 Sportline: 1.5" front drop, 1.4" rear drop
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Rate: 200 front, 333 rear.
    B15 Pro-Kit: 1.2" front drop, 1.0" rear drop
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Rate: 180 front, 300 rear.

    You guessed it, the spring rates are not available from Eibach. Then I found this:
    Quote Originally Posted by Sentra.Net
    Eibach Pro-Kit spring rates: (Rates are lb/in. All rear springs are progressive)

    Car Front Rear Source of Info
    Sentra SE-R: 150 front, 80 - 180 rear Eibach*
    NX2000: 160 front, 80 - 180 rear Eibach*
    200SX SE-R: 160 front, 137 - 257 rear NISMO catalog

    * Kit Wetzler asked an Eibach engineer directly
    Which indicates that the Eibachs for all of our cars are both too low and too soft.

    H&R - H&R Special Springs, LP
    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)
    B13: 1.3" drop front, 1.3" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    B14: 1.5" drop front, 1.4" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    B15: 1.5" drop front, 1.4" drop rear
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Rate: Per H&R's technical support line: "Unavailable to the public. Our Sport springs are designed to be used with the rest of the stock suspension including the struts." Bah, nice guy, lame answer, *CSK's only for a daily driver.
    MSRP all springs: $299.00
    Ballpark price: $210.00 at Tire Rack.

    Intrax - Intraxsuspension - Welcome (Applications: B13, B14, B15)
    Quote Originally Posted by Intrax
    Make Model Year Part Number Type Chassis Front Rear List Price

    Nissan Sentra 87-90 60.1.030 SLS B12 1.8" 1.6" $289

    Nissan Sentra & SER 91-94 60.1.031 SLS B13 2.0" 1.8" $289
    Struts To Use - Will not work well with any struts.

    Nissan Sentra 95-99 60.1.032 SLS B14 2.0" 1.8" $289
    Struts To Use - Will not work well with any struts.

    Nissan Sentra 00- 60.1.034 SLS B15 1.7" 1.5" $289
    Struts To Use - Will not work well with any struts.

    Nissan Sentra Spec V 02- 60.1.038 SLS B15 1.6" 1.5" $309
    Ballpark price: $220'ish

    Megan Racing - Megan Racing (Applications: B13, B14, B15)

    B13 Drop: 2" Front, 1.75-2" Rear
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    B13 spring rate: 230 lbs F & 205 lbs R
    MSRP: $119.95

    B14 Drop: 1.9"-2" Front+Rear
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    B14 spring rate: 280F & 230R
    MSRP: $119.95

    B15 spring rate: 2" Front+Rear
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    B15 spring rate: 240F & 210R
    MSRP: $169.95

    Progress - The Progress Group - (Applications: B13, B15. No on B14.) Per their very knowledgable, friendly sales staff:
    B13: 1.7" drop front, 1.7" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Rate: 165 front, 140 rear.
    MSRP: $209.00

    B15: 1.7" drop front, 1.5" drop rear
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Rate: 190 front, 260 rear
    MSRP: $209.00

    Sprint - Sprint Performance Suspension (Applications: B13, B14, B15)
    All of them: 2" drop front, 2" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Rate - Per Sprint springs technical support line: "Our spring rates are confidential. Competitors have been blatently copying us. All manufacturers would not test them the same anyways (we discussed Dynojet Dynos vs. Mustang Dynos as an analogy). I asked him about the 2" drop, OEM being 3", you now have one inch of suspension travel. He dodged, said all their springs ride great, I will love the way the car drives, etc...." Bah, nice guy, lame answers.

    Suspension Techniques -
    B13: 1.5" drop front, 1.5" drop rear
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Rate: 133-175 front, 91-150 rear
    Ballpark price: $220'ish

    Tein S-Tech and H-Tech - (Applications: B14 and B15 only) http://www.tein.com/stech.html

    B14 S-Tech: 2.4 inch drop front, 1.1 inch drop rear.
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Front spring rate: Kilograms force/mm 3. Pounds/inch 168.
    Rear spring rate: Kilograms force/mm 5. Pounds/inch 280.
    Retail: $240.00

    B14 H-Tech: 2 inch drop front, 0.6 inch drop rear.
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Front spring rate: Kilograms force/mm 3.4. Pounds/inch 190.
    Rear spring rate: Kilograms force/mm 4.4. Pounds/inch 246.
    Retail: $240.00

    Why Tein makes the worst springs for the B14 chassis. Thank you Sentrixx, good discussion:
    Tein S techs - SR20 Forum

    B15 S-Tech: 1.3 inch drop front, 1.1 inch drop rear.
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Front spring rate: Kilograms force/mm 2.7. Pounds/inch 151.
    Rear spring rate: Kilograms force/mm 3.5. Pounds/inch 196.
    Retail: $220.00

    B15 H-Tech: 0.9 inch drop front, 0.6 inch drop rear.
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Front spring rate: Kilograms force/mm 2.75. Pounds/inch 154.
    Rear spring rate: Kilograms force/mm 4.4. Pounds/inch 246.
    Retail: $220.00

    Tokico - Tokico Performance Shocks
    Cheap, old-school springs and struts. I have never read a single good review on these springs or struts on the SR20Forum.

    Pictured is their entire "performance" package.
    B13: 1.25" drop front, 1.25" drop rear
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Rate: 156 front, 152 rear.
    Ballpark price: Less than $500.00 for the entire "performance" package including the (lame) struts as pictured.

    This thread, courtesy of jrmnet, provides insight to the Tokico suspenion:
    Moved to www.gwellwood.com
    Quote Originally Posted by G Wellwood from the link provided
    8 months after I installed these springs and struts, I had become disappointed with the kit...... In competition however....

    Tokico Handing Kit Assessment
    * The car had considerable oversteer on corner entry
    * The reduced front suspension travel bottomed frequently when traversing bumps during turns - even on the street.
    * The front struts were insufficient in dampening the spring motion
    * The car felt "floaty" over bumps - very unsettling
    Those suspension characteristics are unacceptable compromises in a daily driver or track terror. Most of these handling "ills" could be cured with CSK's.

    Vogtland - Vogtland Suspension Lowering Springs - VogtlandSuspension.com
    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)
    B13: 1.6" drop front, 1.6" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Rate: 172 front, 274 rear
    B14: 1.6" drop front, 1.6" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Rate: 172 front, 274 rear.
    B15: 1.6" drop front, 1.6" drop rear
    Struts To Use: Will not work well with any struts.
    Rate: 172 front, 274 rear.
    Ballpark price: $190'ish

    Whiteline - http://www.whiteline.com.au/
    B13: 1.5" drop front, 1.25" drop rear.
    Struts To Use: *CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts.
    Rate: 130/210 front, 95/170 rear. These are a progressive rate spring.
    Ballpark price:

    Much thanks to billc, who got that information through direct correspondence with a Whiteline engineer. Bill is using these springs in conjunction with CSK's on his daily and is very pleased.
    http://www.suspensionparts.info/showthread.php?p=3778


    "*CSK's only for a daily driver, no OEM length struts." Means what it says, if you use CSK's with these springs, it will work fine as a daily-driver. The reasoning is that the actual tiny loss of travel with the springs as indicated, (>/=) 0.50" when utilized with CSK's, combined with the slightly stiffer spring rate than OEM springs works fine.

    Pretty White tried out CSK's combined with the Eibach Pro-Kits, to graciously test that "paper" theory (to be specific, 98sr20ve - Steve's theory). Pretty White is very happy with the combination on wash-board rough, pot-holed, NY City streets:

    Got my shortened Konis (ShawnB, I will report back later) - SR20 Forum
    Last edited by Shawn B; 09-10-11 at 03:38 PM.
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  4. #4
    Techno Viking
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    Location: Louisiana
    Posts: 3,513
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    Struts

    KYB AGX struts - (Application: B13, B14, B15) These are a stock OEM length strut that is a popular purchase on the forum. They are inexpensive, much better than stock, and work well in certain applications. They are a direct bolt-on fitment.

    Mated up with the Hyperco springs, some Koni bumpstops, and you have a very good and inexpensive DD, auto-cross suspension.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car April 2005
    Match....Hyperco....springs with some off-the-shelf adjustable KYB AGX struts, and you almost have a great track-worthy street suspension. Almost. Stiff springs and minimal lowering help keep you off your bumpstops, but they're still not enough. Midcorner bumps will still have you crashing the bumpstops.

    Bump stops are not the end of the suspension's travel, though, nor are they something to be avoided at all costs. A properly designed bump stop will gently increase the overall spring rate in the last inch or so of travel and evan act as its own damper, gently rebounding more like a Nerf ball than a Super Ball.

    Most modern cars use relatively soft microcellular polyurethane foam bump stops that are essentially the hard-core automotive equivalent of Nerf. You can try your luck pilfering these modern stoppers from the junkyard, or you can try the proven solution of Koni Sport bump stops.

    With this simple spring/strut/bump stop combination - the front struts set on three (of four) and the rears on three or four (of eight) - the suspension rides well, is remarkably well controlled and handles bumpy roads with aplomb. (Author Dave Coleman)
    AGX's may work well with the Road Magnets. Further information on pairing them with the RM's will be posted as it becomes available.

    As AGX's are OEM length, they will NOT work well with any of the "other" commercially available springs (H&R, Eibach, etc....). You will be riding on your bumpstops. You will probably damage the AGX's. From this thread: Which Springs/Mounts should I get??? - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    The reason every lowering spring but the Hyperco is bad with the AGX's is because only the Hyperco has the needed spring rate combined with a small drop that will work with OEM length struts. Any other lowering spring is too soft and has too much drop for the OEM length AGX's.
    AGX's will work with your stock OEM springs just fine. Mated with some Progress sway bars, and you would have a much improved daily driver over the stock suspension.
    Quote Originally Posted by Same thread as above
    Quote Originally Posted by Farmboss
    I just want the AGX's i dont care about lowering.... for now I just want to get rid of my current setup.
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    Stock springs, Progress front and rear sway bars would be a nice setup
    How they work:
    Quote Originally Posted by KYB Website
    The compression and rebound rates on the AGX can be adjusted with an external knob on the shock body or a screwdriver slot at the top of the piston rod, depending on model. The knob adjusts both compression and rebound at the same time, with 1 being the softest setting, and 8 being the hardest setting. You select damping rate.
    Ballpark price: $425'ish a set

    (Closed) Group Buy thread: B13/B14 Kyb Agx Round 2 - SR20 Forum

    KYB website opened to SE-R page:
    KYB Shocks and KYB Struts for High Performance Cars and Trucks

    Custom Shortened Koni struts (CSK's forthwith) - (Applications: B13, B14, B15). Just what the name implies, you use a stock OEM strut body, cut down it's length and insert a (Red? Yellow? Oh, my..... Fun Fact about Koni - SR20 Forum) Koni insert into the shortened housing. This provides you with an extra inch of travel in your suspension. Remember, OEM travel is only 3", an extra inch of suspension travel when using lowering springs of any sort helps maintain suspension travel.

    Koni website: Koni: Welcome

    Hypothetically:

    OEM length strut:
    (3" OEM) minus the "drop" on the springs (1.5") = 1.5" of suspension travel left. Not good at all.

    CSK's
    (3" OEM) minus the "drop" on the springs (1.5") = 1.5" of suspension travel. Now add back in the inch that you cut out of the Koni strut length (+ 1") and you have 2.5" of suspension travel. Much closer to orginal OEM of 3".

    * 06/2009 * CURRENT discussion/clarification.
    "Custom Shortened Koni INFO Discussion" thread:
    Custom Shortened Koni INFO Discussion - SR20 Forum

    Ballpark price DIY: XXX
    Ballpark price having them built for you:
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    I can make them a variety of different ways. The breakdown is as follows. Remember this is custom work so I can do it a variety of ways. This also assumes you send me your usable stock housings.

    Koni's (adjustable, but you need to take them off to do it) = $535
    Install them shorter in the front= $75 (this is it for the b14)
    Install all 4 into housing for the b13 housings = $125
    Shorter all the way around = 150 (not needed on the b13, not possible on the b14)
    Add, externally adjustable Fronts on either car = $85 extra for the pair. This allows the use of strong front springs as well. 350lb to 375lb should be ok.
    Custom Mounts for GC perch (allow the use of a 10 inch front spring) = $75 per axle. Only needed up front.

    So if you have a b13 and you want shorter fronts and standard rears (535+125) and you also want the externally adjustable fronts ($85) plus the custom mounts for the longer spring up front only ($75). This puts you at $820 for my work (plus shipping) and then you provide the GC setup (400 at the most). This setup is far nicer then the TEIN in ride. Plus, you can add the GC camber caster plates which give you another 3/4 inch of travel up front. A lot of people already own this GC stuff so it saves them money. Hope that helps.
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    (I recommend....) Koni as your first choice in struts because in the end they are the most versitile strut you can buy. You can run the oem length and learn how to install them like that. If you ever decide you want to lower the car you can shorten them up and still have a great setup. OEM install on a B13 is not that hard and the benifit is great.
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve from later in this thread

    CSK info:

    CSK need to be choosen based on the type of spring you want to use. If you are using oem style spring (any spring that does not use a coilover sleeve) then you have to use the Off The Shelf (OTS) B13 Koni unit for the rear of the B13. With drop springs or coilovers you can use the OTS B13 or B15 unit up front. B13 front unit is a touch shorter then the B15 front but does not have external adjustment while on the car. B15 front unit has external adjustment and those can be adjusted with out removing the strut. If you want to use the OTS Koni Maxima front unit you need to use it with coilovers. To use that you need to use any number of oem nissan housings. Maxima, Altima all have some housings that will work. They need to be a 2 inch O.D. to work.
    Spring Rates
    B13 Fronts =350
    B14 Fronts = 400+ (not as short as the B13, I use it as a rear with the Maxima insert on the B13 with coilovers only).
    B15 Fronts 400-450 (450 is the limit, 400 is better).
    Maxima Fronts= 450+

    Dampening is very personal. Some people may like the B13 fronts with higher then 350 some people would not.
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve from later in this thread

    Adjustability

    Only the B15 front is externally adjustable. All Konis commonly used wtih the B cars are adjustable, you just must remove the spring to do it.
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve later in this thread

    "B14-15 (chassis) have to use OTS (off the shelf) non-shortened units in the rear of the car. They are shocks not struts and are sold complete. They are not inserts that can be relativly easily shortened. Koni can shorten them for you."
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve later in this thread
    Back in the day, the B13 front was the only option commonly tired. Now we have Spec V and Maxima inserts....

    But, knowing what I know now, I recommend the SpecV insert. The cost is less then $10 more.
    BTW, the Maxima insert ($135 from tirerack) as tested by Koni has nearly the same starting rebound dampening as the 8611 but with out the overly stiff compression portion. It's my favorite setup for the front. The B14 Koni front has about 10% less starting dampening as the 8611 and makes a great rear unit for a B13 GC car. In the end my criteria for a shock are:

    1 Shorter then stock
    2 Adjustable
    3 Easily Revalvable
    4 Of a know high Quality
    5 Adaptable to a variety of setups
    6 Race Proven
    7 Will survive a daily driver

    Very few shocks make that list. VERY, VERY few.

    .....There is a heck of a lot more in picking a damper then just looking at a dyno curve. I will take "1 inch plus shorter then stock Koni" over the AGX setup any day of the week on a lowered car. If I was to build up any B13/14/15 my first and only choice would be either a set of Spec V or Maxima/B14 setup depending on the springs I was using..... Just to be clear, it's not "my Maxima" setup in the sense that you have to pay me to get it done. I have posted how to do all this stuff on your own. It's off the shelf simple
    Quote Originally Posted by Koni website
    The red KONI Special is designed for drivers who want to improve their car’s handling. Improved comfort and road holding combined with a higher level of safety, available for almost every car. Each shock absorber is customised for the car model. Hence, a KONI Special is always the best choice for replacement as well as improvement.

    (Yellow Sport) KONI serves sporting drivers with a carefully designed range of sport shock absorbers. This line focuses on exceptional road holding combined with an acceptable level of comfort. Its characteristics include responsive steering, reduced body-roll and limited body movements. Externally adjustable shock absorbers make fine tuning even more easy.


    * 06/2009 * CURRENT discussion/clarification.
    "Custom Shortened Koni INFO Discussion" thread:
    Custom Shortened Koni INFO Discussion - SR20 Forum

    Will my "Brand X" strut body work? Yes, if it is OEM replacement it will work as a donor strut.

    Can I use the Koni's unshortened? Yes. Here's a thread: What is the best street set-up for a 1991 SER suspension - SR20 Forum

    Why go with the Koni's? See thread above. Also, check out this one: Shortened struts - SR20 Forum

    Where can I get these Koni inserts?
    Tire Rack carrries a full line of Koni products: Tires

    Who can make me a set of CSK's already shortened that I can just bolt-on and go?

    1) You can contact forum member 98sr20ve, Steve. However, PLEASE do NOT contact Steve unless you are damned serious and have money in your hand. He is a very busy man, so please do not bug him for no reason. He will determine if/when he can help you out based on his schedule not yours. There is no "haggling" on his prices, pay what he charges and smile, it is a veritable bargain. He is a very nice guy doing you a great favor, he does not need your "business." Please treat him and his very valuable and limited time with a great amount of respect. Comprende?

    2) You can contact TheKid29. It is readily apparent that he does terrific work and offers his services here:
    B13 Struts Koni 8610 or 8611 - SR20 Forum

    From our Tech Library, how to make them:
    How to shorten your own Koni struts. - SR20 Forum
    Isfahan provided excellent photos of his Koni build-up:
    Koni pile of parts:

    Assembled Koni red:

    Assembled Koni yellow:

    Koni Red with bumpstop and dust boot:


    Current "How To" discussion courtesy of VQman:
    http://www.sr20-forum.com/suspension...r-springs.html

    Koni's web-site: Koni: Welcome

    Other Struts

    Replacement struts for your OEM struts. (Application: B13, B14, B15)

    Tokico HP Series (commonly Tokico Blues) - http://www.tokicogasshocks.com/products/hp/
    Work fine as a replacement strut for your OEM strut. They are not an upgrade of any sort. The quality is fine, Tokico builds struts for many Japanese car manufacturers.
    Ballpark price - $90'ish or so per strut.

    KYB GR2's - KYB Shocks and KYB Struts for High Performance Cars and Trucks Another replacement strut for your OEM strut. Nothing fancy, does the job, not an upgrade.
    Ballpark price - $85'ish rear, $70'ish front

    Bump Stops

    (Application: B13, B14, B15)

    These handy little items should not be overlooked as unimportant when you are modifying your suspension. As your suspension hits full compression, these little "cushions" can help absorb the shock and avoid damaging your struts.

    Koni - Absolutely excellent choice. Recommended by Sport Compact Car, see article posted above. Ballpark price: $80.00.

    Where can I buy the Koni bumpstops? Available at forum vendor Greg V at G-Spec:
    http://gspec.com/c-29-1991-1994.aspx

    Isfahan providing another excellent picture of an OEM vs. Koni bumpstop:

    Koni on the right.

    Why are the Koni's the best bumpstops you can buy? This thread, courtesy of bobbyisking, has Steve (98sr20ve) and Mike Kojima (Choaderboy2) discussing the issue:
    energy suspension vs koni bump stops? - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    In your shortravel setups a bumpstop becomes a extension of the primary spring. You will hit it. Difference becomes how progressive/hard the transition is from the main spring to the bumpstop. Koni are softer and ramp up to the end of travel in a smoother fashion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Choaderboy2
    Koni foamies are the best.
    Which Koni bumpstop do I buy? Thank you LBCStudios:
    quick koni bumpstop ? - SR20 Forum

    Cutting Koni bumpstops to gain more travel. Thank you Sentrixx, much appreciated.
    nissanperformancemag.com
    Photo from link, Nissan Performance Magazine:


    Energy Suspension - Welcome to Energy Suspension!
    Has two (2) freakin' pages of bumpstops. They make theirs out of urethane in various durometers.

    Ground Control - Offers four (4) types of bumpstops.
    MSRP: $12.00 per bumpstop, $48.00 for a set.

    Note, the one on the far right looks very much like a Koni.

    KYB - Nope. Not on their web-site.

    Nissan OEM - You get new ones automatically when you buy strut boots. (See dust boots.) You cannot buy them seperately.

    Dust Boots

    (Application: B13, B14, B15)

    Keeps your expensive new struts working properly. Cheap insurance that you don't get grit and grime into the working mechanisms. (Also "strut boots.")

    Nissan OEM - Buy two (2) pairs of B13 front dust boots. The front OEM dustboots have removable bump stops. They just pop out by hand. The rear OEM dustboots have the bumpstop built in, you cannot remove it.
    Greg V at G-Spec, forum friendly vendor for OEM parts:
    http://gspec.com/c-29-1991-1994.aspx


    Quote Originally Posted by vqman
    If I am correct on this, can we add part number 54052M to the Nissan front dust boot list? I believe it's the OEM Nissan part number.

    KYB - KYB Shocks and KYB Struts for High Performance Cars and Trucks They have them. I'd personally go OEM Nissan, but how difficult is it to make a strut boot?

    Strut Mounts

    (Application: B13, B14, B15)

    Nissan OEM - They are what they are, a pretty simple device.

    If the mounting studs are too short when you add a FSTB or RSTB, see the following thread.
    Modification for longer OEM studs.
    How To: Upgrade Your OEM Strut Mount Studs

    Motivational Rear Strut Mount - (Application: B14, XXX will have to check) An aftermarket rear strut mount that increases your travel.

    Sentrixx brought this Nissan Performance Magazine link to my attention. Bad-ass install of a complete B14 suspension including the Motivational Mounts.
    nissanperformancemag.com
    Last edited by Shawn B; 04-19-12 at 08:31 AM.
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  5. #5
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    III. Coilover systems


    Advance Design and Ground Control - Ground Control Suspension Systems

    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)

    Advance Design (subcategory of Ground Control) - I just called them (09/25/06). Advance Design is engineered with racing applications in mind, and would probably be fairly harsh on the street. You should contact Advance Design through the Ground Control web-site. They are very freindly and extremely knowledgeable. The product is ordered and engineered based on your needs and uses with Advance Design expertise. Very cool.
    Ballpark price with all the good stuff: $2,500.00'ish
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car Magazine August 2004
    In the SE-R Cup, where engine output is heavily regulated, it's the car with the best balanced suspension that's ahead of the pack. Knowing this, Tony has taken the time to sort out the B13's dynamics. In both the front and back, Tony chose Ground Control Advance Design two-way adjustable struts, which are shortened 1.5 inches. These, along with Eibach ERS race springs at 600 lb/in., allow for easy adjustments. Ground Control plates allow Tony to dial-in the perfect camber and caster, while Progress Group adjustable anti-roll bars tie each side together. Energy Suspension polyurethane bushings eliminate slop, and unique to the front end is a Stillen strut tower brace and custom lower control arm sub-frame brace. Tony also relocated the Wesco gel-cell battery to the trunk to take some weight off the front tires and improve weight distribution.
    Ground Control makes "coilover conversion kits" which install on AGX or Koni struts. You supply the strut.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bennito Mallitto, post #35 this thread
    Ground Control/AGX
    MSRP: $399.00
    Rate: Variable, you pick the Eibach springs from their inventory.

    From this very good thread: Your Opinion - Best coilovers for DD + weekend autocross. - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    Oh, BTW, I am convinced with out a doubt that the absolute best daily driver+HPDE/autocross setup is the Koni paired with GC sleeves and a real front pearch the kills 99% of any rattles (all coilovers can make some noise). Pair that with a 300-325# 10 inch front spring, GC Camber Plate. Set the rideheight to and 1.5 or so below stock That leaves you with stock levels of suspension travel. I would stack it up against anything anyone else makes in the 1200 price range.
    Here is a pic of that front perch, courtesy of veilside18sx:

    See that silver ring just past the GC sleeve? That's the real front perch that Steve mentions (picture is from a B15 setup).

    Taiden shows you how to modify a stock strut (AGX in this case) lower spring perch to accept a GC sleeve with no welding.
    How To: Cut lower spring perch for ground control sleeves - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by Taiden via PM
    I was looking all over the place for a write up for how to trim the lower spring perch instead of getting weld on perches from Ground Control. I could find no such thread, so I pulled off my AGXs and figured out what needed to be done to do it.

    I am really happy with the result. It doesnt clank anymore and it looks freaking awesome on the car. Like I said before, I just gained another 2" or so of tire space in the rear. Not sure about the front because of fender rub, but I gained the same strut clearance in the front.

    Really excited to get this out there for sr20forum.
    I'm very impressed with your home-brew, ghetto-fabulous, downright ingenious results. Gracias! Pic of Taidens final product:


    B+G - http://www.b-gsuspension.com/home.shtml
    (Applications: No longer available for any Nissan chassis.)
    Don't know much about these yet. Made in Sweden, yah.
    Quote Originally Posted by B+G website
    S3 Coilovers are designed and produced exclusively by world class motorsport technicians. Each application combines race proven technology with the vehicle"s unique design characteristics for the ultimate in ride and handling.

    -Ride height adjustment from 1 to 3 inches lower than factory.
    -Dual spring design perched on monotube gas charged dampers.
    -Low bleed system to maintain ride quality and eliminate the harsh ride associated with other coilover systems.
    -Proprietary speed sensitive mechanism automatically adjusts dampening for improved handling during high-speed or aggressive driving conditions.

    MSRP: $1,490.00

    Bits And Pieces - Bits & Pieces Motorsports - Hardware and Supplies

    Applications:

    B13 - Ready to go, bolt-on, race ready, dialed in, suspension.
    MSRP: $2,513.00

    B14 & B15: They would need a donor car in order to make the suspension, but they could certainly do so.

    An extremely high-quality, well engineered and tested, race ready suspension. You have to be pretty serious about road racing (on the track, duh) your vehicle to consider this option. This is not for your average enthusiast, it is designed specifically for racing. The price reflects the incredibly high quality level of the suspension.

    Your best bet, if you are considering this suspension is to call the manufacturer directly. Their phone number is on their web-site. They could make a B13 "street/auto-cross" suspension if you desired. The could make a B14/15 set-up but they need a car to work with. I'm pretty sure they could do any damn thing you want. Very friendly on the phone.

    From this web-site: nissanperformancemag.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kojima
    For an affordable solution to our suspension dilemma we selected the Koni 8611 damper. Not to be confused with the street performance Koni red or the Yellow Koni Sport, the 8611 is Koni's universal racing short body MacPherson strut. It is a true racing damper. The 8611's need to be adapted to the NX chassis and coil over Eibach racing ERS springs using the AW Racing/Bits and Pieces Strut tube covered in the last suspension installment of Project Racer. The tubes feature laser cut thick section mounting tabs tig welded to .120 wall DOM tubing. This construction is much stronger than the stock Nissan hardware and assures flex free support of the wheel assembly under the hardest cornering loads. The tubes are zinc plated for corrosion resistance and have a scraper seal in the gland nut packing to protect the seals of the Koni damper inside. The rear tube has an offset built into the mounting ears and the upper mount to move the strut inboard so a 225mm wide tire on a 7" wide wheel with a common 35mm offset can be used with no rubbing, spacers and fiddling around. Typically a B13 can only run a 205 rear tire without fiddling with spacers and longer studs. The rear upper mount holds the damper shaft with a spherical bearing to assure that all well motion will pass through the damper and that flex will not reduce negative camber under side load. The big squishy rubber stock part is not good at either of these attributes.

    The best news is that our suspension setup is now available and for sale by Bits and Pieces. We highly recommend this as an entry level race setup that can carry the racer from a beginner all the way to advanced speeds and setups.
    Mikes opinion on Bits and Peices from this thread:
    Bad Ass Suspension - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by choaderboy 2 aka Mike Kojima
    Best for the money hands down.
    A kick-ass thread from our Motorsports section featuring Mike Kojima: Working on a new low cost suspension for B13's - SR20 Forum

    Hot Bits - http://www.hotbits.org/ A serious suspension for racing.

    An extra bit (hehe) of knowledge:
    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    Might want to add to the hots bits, that the DT (DT2, 2 way adjustible ) series coil is avalibe for the B13 platform. Even though its not listed in there catalog. Thats what I have installed in the NX.
    I am not even sure what Nick is talking about, but I'll take his word for it.
    Ultra cool pics courtesy of Nick as well:



    Ksport or D2's - Ksport USA - Performance Suspension

    (Applications: B13, B14, B15, N16)

    Ksport currently offers three (3) different coilover applications for the B13, the GT Pro Damper, Kontrol, and Version RR (race only).

    Ksport and D2's are the same item, different in name only:
    Quote Originally Posted by hpro123
    Yes, Ksport and D2 are DEFINITELY designed and manufactured at the same locations by the same company (D2Racing is the "mother" company). They have directly said in the past that Ksport was "speced" by the original Japanese importer, both in design and in coloring.

    (More information.....)

    Anyway, bottom line is that we got in touch with D2 in Taiwan and they offered us 2 choices for the GB, either D2 in purple color or Ksport in orange and they did say that excluding minor differences like the body-lengthening retainer mechanism all the rest and the internals were identical since they did design/produce them right there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ksport website

    Ksport GT Pro Damper System (B13, B14, B15 ed.) provides the ultimate in suspension technology featuring its inverted monotube design, 36-way adjustable dampening, adjustable spring perch, adjustable body and pillow-ball mounts. With the gas/oil chamber farther away from the knuckle and braking system reducing heat transfer This design also reduces under-sprung weight, which improves handeling and responsiveness.

    36 levels of dampening adjustment allow you to fine tune the ride to your handling and comfort needs. The dampening adjusts compression and rebound simultaneously for ease of adjustment. Pillow ball top mounts in the front and rear on some applications allow you to maintain vehicle manufacturer suspension geometry design. The pillow ball top mounts also allow you a more direct feel for solid driver response. Camber adjustability is included on pillow ball top mounts that allow it for the ability to adjust camber from the actual coilover, instead of a separate camber kit.

    Most applications utilize an adjustable lower mount, which means you adjust height without losing suspension travel like some other coilover designs do. With the mounts and most pieces of the coilover being designed for 6061 billet aluminum the kit is lightweight, durable, and rust resistant. The steel shock body is electroplated with zinc to resist rust and the elements. The valving of each set is matched to the springs installed for unmatched ride quality and reliability.

    The Ksport system uses a Monotube design in which the oil and gas are separated within the cylinder. When compared to twin tube designs the Monotube dissipates heat better, allows finer dampening adjustments, and requires more expensive design process. Aeration and cavatation are a lot less common in a Monotube design, which results in a better ride.

    Key Features:

    Inverted steel shock absorber for durability
    Lower center of gravity and higher chassis rigidity
    Designed to reduce friction for cooler shock oil temperature
    Inverted design like vehicles in WRC and all JGTC cars
    36-way adjustable dampening
    Made from high quality 6061 Aluminum with T6 for increased hardness
    Compression/Rebound adjustable
    Adjustable spring perch for height adjustment
    Adjustable body allowing maximum suspension travel
    Pillow Ball Top Mount w/ adjustable camber (not available for some models)
    Monotube High Pressure Design reduces oil leakage
    Electroplated body for protection from corrosion and rust
    One Year Limited Warranty
    Incl. Front Pillow Ball Mount & Rear Top Mount / Front & Rear Inverted Tube.
    Spring Rates: Front 7/392, Rear 5/280

    MSRP: $1,700.00
    Ballpark street price: $1,200.00
    Quote Originally Posted by Ksport website

    Ksport Kontrol Pro Fully Adjustable Coilover Kits (B13, B14, B15, N16 ed.) provide the ultimate in suspension technology for your street or track car. 36 levels of dampening adjustment allow you to fine tune the ride to your handling and comfort needs. The dampening adjusts compression and rebound simultaneously for ease of adjustment. Pillow ball top mounts in the front and rear on some applications allow you to maintain vehicle manufacturer suspension geometry design. The pillow ball top mounts also allow you a more direct feel for solid driver response. Camber adjustability is included on pillow ball top mounts that allow it for the ability to adjust camber from the actual coilover, instead of a separate camber kit.

    Most applications utilize an adjustable lower mount, which means you adjust height without losing suspension travel like some other coilover designs do. With the mounts and most pieces of the coilover being designed for 6061 billet aluminum the kit is lightweight, durable, and rust resistant. The steel shock body is electroplated with zinc to resist rust and the elements. The valving of each set is matched to the springs installed for unmatched ride quality and reliability.

    The Ksport system uses a Monotube design in which the oil and gas are separated within the cylinder. When compared to twin tube designs the Monotube dissipates heat better, allows finer dampening adjustments, and requires more expensive design process. Aeration and cavatation are a lot less common in a Monotube design, which results in a better ride.

    The Ksport Kontrol Pro Coilover kit has been designed with professional road racing in mind offering extremely high value and performance.

    Key Features:

    36-way adjustable dampening
    Made from high quality 6061 Aluminum with T6 for increased hardness
    Compression/Rebound adjustable
    Adjustable spring perch for height adjustment
    Adjustable body allowing maximum suspension travel
    Pillow Ball Top Mount w/ adjustable camber (not available for some models)
    Monotube High Pressure Design reduces oil leakage
    Electroplated body for protection from corrosion and rust
    One Year Limited Warranty
    Incl. Front Pillow Ball Mount & Rear Top Mount.
    Spring Rates: Front 7/392, Rear 5/280

    MSRP: $1,150.00
    Ballpark street price: $800.00
    Quote Originally Posted by Ksport website

    Ksport Version RR Damper System (Not specified which Nissan models are covered.) is built specifically for road racing only. Aggressive rates and valving are chosen for maximum handling and performance with acute reaction and responsiveness. Integrated with 36 levels of dampening adjustment, simultaneous compression and rebound adjustment, lightweight aluminum mounts, and pillow ball upper mounts on some applications. (Race use only.)

    36 levels of dampening adjustment allow you to fine tune the ride to your handling and comfort needs. The dampening adjusts compression and rebound simultaneously for ease of adjustment. Pillow ball top mounts in the front and rear on some applications allow you to maintain vehicle manufacturer suspension geometry design. The pillow ball top mounts also allow you a more direct feel for solid driver response. Camber adjustability is included on pillow ball top mounts that allow it for the ability to adjust camber from the actual coilover, instead of a separate camber kit.

    Most applications utilize an adjustable lower mount, which means you adjust height without losing suspension travel like some other coilover designs do. With the mounts and most pieces of the coilover being designed for 6061 billet aluminum the kit is lightweight, durable, and rust resistant. The steel shock body is electroplated with zinc to resist rust and the elements. The valving of each set is matched to the springs installed for unmatched ride quality and reliability.

    The Ksport system uses a Monotube design in which the oil and gas are separated within the cylinder. When compared to twin tube designs the Monotube dissipates heat better, allows finer dampening adjustments, and requires more expensive design process. Aeration and cavatation are a lot less common in a Monotube design, which results in a better ride.

    Key Features:

    Agressive valving and spring rates
    Reinforced internals
    Race applications only
    36-way adjustable dampening
    Made from high quality 6061 Aluminum with T6 for increased hardness
    Compression/Rebound adjustable
    Adjustable spring perch for height adjustment
    Adjustable body allowing maximum suspension travel
    Pillow Ball Top Mount w/ adjustable camber (not available for some models)
    Monotube High Pressure Design reduces oil leakage
    Electroplated body for protection from corrosion and rust
    One Year Limited Warranty
    Incl. Front Pillow Ball Mount & Rear Top Mount. Spring Rate: Front *, Rear *

    MSRP: $1,450.00
    Ballpark street price: $995.00
    Current Group Buy thread - Ksport GB LOWEST PRICES EVER! - SR20 Forum

    D2 (Ksport Kontrol) review thread..comments by 98sr20ve:
    D2 coilover reviews. - SR20 Forum
    Last edited by Shawn B; 09-10-11 at 03:04 PM.
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  6. #6
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    Motivational Engineering - Motivational Engineering - Performance Parts and Accessories for Import and Domestic Vehicles
    I am *pretty darned sure* that Motivational no longer offers their suspension for our cars. XXXXX left message with Moti 09/25....

    Borrowed some photos from the SCC issue on the 200sx 1.6 liter Project Car: http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/pr..._200sx_part_1/

    Note: Motivational coilover ready damper on the left, Moti damper with perch for standard spring applications , OEM damper on the far right for comparison.


    From this link:
    sentra.net
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kojima
    Motivational has perhaps the biggest suspension bang for the buck. They feature single adjustable (rebound damping), rebuildable Koni dampers with a shortened coil over body. The body is shortened about 2 inches from stock enabling lowering of the car up to 2.5" with good performance and minimal bottoming.
    Progress - The Progress Group - (Application: B13 only)
    A very high quality, off the shelf, coilover system. Workable as a daily driver, excellent for auto-cross or road racing. It comes pre-set up from the factory, damping is non-adjustable. Bolt it on and go. Very quickly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car April 2005
    The same relentless pestering that convinced Hyperco to make its sports springs also convinced Progress to make SE-R coil-overs. Have a 13-year tuning history and an active base of enthusiasts unwilling to tolerate half-assed parts means B13 Sentra stuff better be good. To that end, we contributed our SE-R and our calibrated asses to a several-monthlong development process that resulted in a truly amazing suspension.

    There's nothing particularly special about how Progress coil-overs are made. They're heavy steel with internals you might find in an O.E. shock. But it isn't fancy parts that make a suspension good, it's the tuning. After several iterations, the Progress coil-overs are tuned for an amazing balance of ride quality and ridiculous handling. (Author Dave Coleman)
    These two quotes sum up the "adjustability" or "no adjustability" discussion:
    Quote Originally Posted by Coach
    honestly, for most of us the Progress are the best bet. I say that because most of us don't really have the time/ability to set all those settings the way they need to be to get the car to perform at its peak anyway. I know that I don't have the lap time and stuff to make adjustments and re-run/make adjustments again/re-run/make sway bar adjustment/re-run and so on before an event. I am a noob to racing though, so who knows? I like the progress setup because they work damn well, price is good, quality is great! Brent
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kojima
    The Progress (*coilovers) will be a good value but you have to accept their valving. Many racers are not sensitive enough or intuitive enough to properly set up suspensions. I have had to straighten out a few cars where racers really screwed them up by trying to adjust the dampers without understanding how they work. For these people Progress will be sweet. You just have to like the way Jared and I are going to set up the damping and spring rates.

    MSRP: $1,499.00

    Per Progress sales staff: Yes, these are compatible with the Ground Control camber plates. There is hardware available from Progress to make them copasetic.

    (Closed) Progress Group Buy thread: Progress Coilovers, Swaybars, LCA braces - SR20 Forum

    Choaderboy2 (Mike Kojima) discusses the Progress coilovers:
    Drove the new Progress coil overs - SR20 Forum

    Shigspeed - Here's what I know:
    Quote Originally Posted by Blair via PM
    They are Koni 8611's in custom housings using GC collars. His rear mounts for B13's do kick serious ass, i don't know about the B14's.

    I don't know if he's still making them or not. As far as I know, there never was a website. I always contacted him directly.

    Really nicely machined rear pillowball mounts that eliminate all play. I'll take some pics of mine in the car. I thought I had some before the install but I don't.

    I didn't have too many questions, since I got to drive a car with them and go for a track ride. Sold me on the spot!

    You won't find much else out there info wise.
    Thank you Blair for your expertise and help.

    To quote from Nissan Performance Magazine at this link:
    nissanperformancemag.com
    Quote Originally Posted by Nissan Performance Magazine
    Scott Higashi, owner and fabricator of SHigSpeed, put it to us this way: "if you want to just plain handle than this is the suspension for you."

    The SHigSpeed Suspension consists of shortened externally adjustable Koni Sport Struts (Yellows) front and rear with adjustable rebound and dampening. The rebound can be doubled and the compression can be tripled to go from street cruiser to crack your dental work track ready status. The strut shaft on these Koni's is a stout 22mm vs 18 and 20 mm on our previous setup. For springs Eibach ERS are used with spring rates at 380 front and 300 rear. Most aggressive street SE-Rs run 300 front and 200 rear but we're willing to compromise a little comfort to ensure our suspension is more at home on the track. Mr. Higashi has this specific setup on his personal daily driver so we figured it would be a good setup for us as well. If we'd like to go more aggressive for the track or softer for the street Eibach has ERS spring rates in increments of 25lbs to suit specific conditions. (Author Aaron Labeau)
    Here's a cool link on installing a Shigspeed suspension on a B14. Should be reasonably similar and give you an idea of both the product and the labor. Certain details will differ on a B13, duh.:
    SHigSpeed Install

    Shocktek - Is out of business. Based on a shortened strut. Very high quality, bad-ass suspension.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car July 2000
    The first part of our solution (*to limited suspension travel in the B13), stiffer, shorter shocks, came from Shocktek in Girard, Penn. Shocktek offers semi-custom shocks built to order, and has already built shocks for several SE-R's. They start with Bilstein inverted struts and re-valve and re-size them as necessary. The stock struts (supplied by you) are then modified to accept the Bilstein dampers. Shocktek can also make them adjustable by adding a tapered needle valve in the middle of the piston.

    Shocktek can build its shocks with conventional spring seats for stock or off-the-shelf lowering springs, or with threaded collars for race springs. Using threaded collars allowed us to tap into Eibach's vast catalog of race springs. The Eibach Race Spring (ERS) system covers virtually every spring rate possible in 25 lb/in increments, giving us virtually limitless suspension tuning options. (Author uncited, probably Dave Coleman).
    I *believe* that Shocktek was using the Ground Control "threaded collars for race springs."

    Tein - http://www.tein.com/nissan.html
    B13 - Super Street only. Listed incorrectly as a "200sx B13" on their website
    B14 - Basics and Super Street.
    B15 - Basics and Super Street.
    Tein uses this photo for both the Basics and Super Street systems:

    Quote Originally Posted by Tein web-site
    TEIN has developed advanced technology to design the shell case and stroke to bring out the full potential of your vehicle.
    These features of the TEIN Super Street Damper kit (B13, B14, B15) were designed with greater performance to satisfy all your driving demands. This high performance damper can be used for weekend racing and/or daily driving.
    The discomfort caused by uneven roads or bumps are eliminated on daily street use. For race use, the ride height adjustable system enables you to adjust ride height and 16 levels of damping force.
    In other words, you can set your vehicle to meet all situations!

    * High performance and cost effective.
    * 16 levels of damping force adjustment (compression and rebound together).
    * Ride height adjustable.
    * New paint coating for rust prevention.
    * Pillow ball mounts are optional (on certain applications).
    * Exclusive design for USA vehicle specifications (only available for the U.S.A Market).
    * Available for overhaul
    B13 stock spring rates - 448 front, 336 rear. You can buy seperate springs that vary by as much as (+/-) 110 pounds from the included springs both front and rear. The struts can handle it according to Tein. If you are using these as a daily driver, you may want to consider softer springs (350'ish front, 230'ish rear).
    Quote Originally Posted by Tein website
    TEIN Type BASIC damper (B14, B15 only) is for the driver that is seeking high performance with a reasonable price. The Basic damper MSRP starts at $750.00, which includes 4 springs and 4 shocks. Compared to the "sleeve type" coil over, the Type Basic has a more exclusive set up for a better balance of suspension travel and damping force.

    * High performance and cost effective.
    * Ride Height adjustable.
    * New paint coating for rust prevention.
    * Pillow ball mounts are optional (on certain applications).
    * Exclusive design for USA vehicle specifications.
    (only available for the U.S.A Market).
    * Available for overhaul.
    Tein Sticky right below this one: Teins are being made for the B13! - SR20 Forum
    Last edited by Shawn B; 07-08-09 at 12:00 PM.
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  7. #7
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    IV. Bushings

    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)

    Bushings are the little rubber "washers" and "bumpers" that are sandwiched between all your suspension pieces. Like all manufacturers, Nissan makes these out of fairly soft durometer rubber in order to keep suspensions quiet and fairly compliant. For an enthusiast, this can be a problem as the soft rubber allows "slop" and shifting under load of the suspension components.

    Nissan OEM - Unfortunately you cannot buy new OEM bushings seperately. You have to buy the "hard part" from Nissan that incorporates the bushing. You want a new control arm bushing set? Buy new control arms. Bummer.

    Energy Suspension - Welcome to Energy Suspension! Urethane replacement bushings for your suspension.

    No real unexpected downside to this modification, the cars suspension will feel sharper and more precise, perhaps more harsh over bumps depending on the rest of your set-up.

    The issue of "suspension bind" in the rear of the B13 chassis. Please read the following links. Everyone agrees that the issue exists. Mike Kojima (choaderboy2) believes the issue is relatively insignificant in its effect on the chassis. Steve Foltz (98sr20ve) believes the issue can be very significant in its effects on the chassis. These two guys are very smart and they disagree? It happens, get over it. Finally, BenFenner jumps in with his input, diagrams, and in-depth analysis of the issue.

    I am no expert, but I *believe* that Mike and Steve are both correct. They both took the suspensions apart, and moved the part in question through its range of motion. Each drawing different conclusions. The parts were the same, the bushing were the same. However, the geographical locations, original installations, local weather conditions, and the actual vehicles donating the test parts were different.

    Can suspension bind affect your car? Yes. To what degree and is it significant? Without further scientific testing you shall have to decide for yourself dear reader. I cannot possibly argue either way, nor even begin to question Steve, Mike or Ben.

    Here's all the threads on Suspension Bind:

    Very informative thread on rear suspension bind on the B13, which includes links to other threads on the same issue:
    ES bushings purchase help.... - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    You do relize that you really don't want to replace every control arm bushing in the rear with ES bushing. Leave the trailing link one alone. Don't do es on that. Search around the site about suspension bind and you will find the info.
    I took Steve's sage advice and I did search around the Forum.
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    They don't have to squeek to cause the problems. If they are frozen in place they are silent. Mine never made a single sound. The change happens so gradually that many people don't notice it. The front of the Sentra is really not so bad. It only has two es bushings and I never had an issue with them. Rear of a B13 is different. Many people say to never use the one for the locating arm as it causes the suspension to bind. Rear of a 240 is a nightmare. If you use all the es bushings it will suck. The suspension is a multi link with toe and camber changes as the suspension moves. This is by design. Problem is the ES bushings cause that setup to become so rigid that the suspension does not want to move. The easy fix is to simple not use the ES stuff in the back. Or pick and choice which ones would be most helpfull. I did not know this (because no one talks about this) and quickly found out the hard way. Then the best option is to use spherical arms that allow the suspension to follow its desired arc. This combined with properly lubed bushings solves the issue. B13 would benefit from some similar thinking. The rear has two parallel arms that want to move up and down. The locating arm moves in a arc, pulling those two arms forward when the suspension compresses. This changes toe but with the rigid ES bushings also causes bind. That’s why many people choose not to install the ES bushing in this arm.
    So to wrap up. The front on a Sentra is not so bad even with the ES bushings. Rear of the B13 can be a problem.
    If that isn't clear enough, BenFenner lays out a comprehensive breakdown of the problem illustrating what 98sr20ve describes above using pictures. Hopefully educating you enough so that you may make up your own mind on the subject.
    http://www.sr20-forum.com/suspension...tml#post107103

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnand
    There was a thread that I posted a while back about the rear suspension bind and the consensous was the trailing arm frame bushing should remain rubber as it need to move fore and aft.
    Quote Originally Posted by Slartitbartfast
    Trailing arm is indeed the culprit. You must leave rubber on one end to allow the arm to move fore/aft as hub moves up/down.
    Another very good thread with Steve dropping knowledge on the issue of suspension bind:
    To ES bush or not to ES bush+other susp questions. - SR20 Forum

    In these threads, Suspension Bind gets discussed further, Mike Kojima bringing in his expertise and disagreeing with how much of an issue "suspension bind" really is.

    From this thread you are reading, post 134 onward....
    Choaderboy2 post #134:
    B13, B14, B15 Suspension Information..... - Page 7 - SR20 Forum
    Choaderboy2 post #136:
    B13, B14, B15 Suspension Information..... - Page 7 - SR20 Forum
    98sr20ve post #137:
    B13, B14, B15 Suspension Information..... - Page 7 - SR20 Forum
    98sr20ve post #140:
    B13, B14, B15 Suspension Information..... - Page 7 - SR20 Forum
    98sr20ve post #143:
    B13, B14, B15 Suspension Information..... - Page 8 - SR20 Forum
    Choaderboy2 post #144:
    B13, B14, B15 Suspension Information..... - Page 8 - SR20 Forum

    From our Road Race Section, yet more discussion of "suspension bind":
    NX suspension setup - Page 2 - SR20 Forum


    Do I really need ES bushings? If you are not going to the track, perhaps you utilize the car as a daily driver and occasional autocross, this is something to carefully consider:
    Quote Originally Posted by FastNX
    I know this was not brought up, but I'm going to go on the record as questioning whether or not it is going to be worth your while to even do the ES bushings, from both a cost-benefit standpoint, and a 'do you really need them' view.

    Having installed a B13 ES master set on my old NX, I cursed myself for having ever considered the idea. Some of those parts just don't want to come undone, and you may end up replacing a few other things you hadn't planned on (such as the kingpin). Since you're paying for labour, it's probably going to be $300+ for the ES kit and having them installed. You are going to love your car with the spring/strut/sway bar/strut bar combo, it may blow you away enough without blowing your pocket book away too.
    I followed FastNX's advice (thank you, sir). I did not go with the very popular "you gotta have a full ES bushing set" philosophy. On my daily driver (only), there was simply no need for ES bushings.

    Whiteline - Whiteline Automotive - performance handling and suspension products. car spring coil shock damper swaybar sway bar anti-sway bush bushes australia australian whiteline automotive performance road holding turn-in camber caster toe in vehicle hot 4 v8
    Has all kinds of stuff for the N14 (B13) chassis, including polyurethane bushings.

    Choaderboy2 drops knowledge on Whiteline caster bushings:
    Really good bang for the buck suspension mod - SR20 Forum

    Superpro - http://www.superpro.com.au/superpro.html
    Offers all kinds of polyurethane bushings including applications for the B13. Their web-site makes my head hurt.

    Superpro caster bushings for sale thread:
    superpro bushings - SR20 Forum

    Superpro available from a Forum Vendor, which you should naturally support as a member of this community: superpro bushings - SR20 Forum

    Spherical metal bushings - Replaces the entire OEM rubber bushing with metal on metal bushings. Takes every last bit of "slop" out of your suspension.

    Some threads courtesy of b13magoo, gracias sir.

    Ground Control and how they tested, refined and utilize spherical bearings in their camber plates.
    Ground Control Suspension Systems - Your source for the best in suspension parts and accessories.

    The HRP World web-site. The sell serious racing parts and equipment, including spherical bearings of all sorts.
    Race Car Rod Ends and Spherical Bearings

    From this thread:
    Project Nissan 300ZX: Part 6 - Project Cars - Sport Compact Car Magazine
    Concerning Heim joints on the discontinued NuTech sway bar.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car Web
    NuTech Speed-Link adjustable anti-roll bar end link
    NuTech Suspension's Ken Nord noticed several problems with traditional aftermarket anti-roll bar end links. Many of the popular aftermarket bars have end links that are not even at the ends, causing the bar to pre-load the car in one direction or the other. To prevent jacking weight on the car, which can interfere with corner weighting and other set-up operations, you must shim the end links to assure that the bar is not twisted and pre-loading any of the wheels.

    Also, the end links are often kinked at acute angles on lowered cars. This is because most aftermarket bars are designed on cars at stock height. The stock rubber or urethane bushings can also contribute to play in the bar, binding of the bar and limiting its effectiveness by taking up body motion in mushing the soft material.

    The rear end links on Project Z displayed some of these negative attributes. Our bar was bent slightly off so we had to shim the end links on one side during our original installation. Since the car was lowered, the end links were bent at an acute angle, and the end link bushings took up some of the bar's effectiveness, especially when the rear bar was set, like ours, to full stiff.

    To cure this, we installed some NuTech adjustable Speed-Link end links. The NuTech end links replace all of the stock rubber or aftermarket polyurethane with zero play, inflexible spherical bearing Heim joints. Now every bit of body roll gets transferred into the sway bar, greatly increasing its effectiveness. The NuTech end links are also shorter and adjustable so they can be set as close to 90 degrees to the bar as possible. This ensures that all of the body motion gets transferred into the bar right away, rather than being wasted on straightening out the end link. The smooth-acting Heim joints also eliminate any bind that is present in the bushings. Finally, the individual length of the links can be adjusted to eliminate wheel preloading caused by a slightly mis-bent anti-roll bar. This also helps keep the end link angle close to 90 degrees because the overall length of the link can be adjusted when the link is moved to different stiffness settings.

    Although the NuTech end links seem like a small detail, we could actually feel the difference. The new links helped the car rotate better in lift-throttle conditions. In fact, the bar works so much better, we may have to re-adjust it one-step softer as the car is a bit too tail-happy now. (Author Mike Kojima).
    In Sport Compact Car magazine, Mike Kojima installs a bunch of trick spherical bushings in his 300ZX street monster. Project 300ZX TT - Project Cars - Sport Compact Car Magazine

    From the SCC article, this is an example of what they look like:

    Here they are installed in a....suspension component.


    This thread is damned cool. Covers the Shigspeed upper mounts for our cars. Great pictures also.
    Hyperco and Shigspeed - SR20 Forum
    Last edited by Shawn B; 07-09-09 at 03:14 PM.
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  8. #8
    Techno Viking
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Louisiana
    Posts: 3,513
    Feedback Score: 14 (100%)

    Default

    V. Braces

    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)

    Our B13, B14, B15's are old, they were flexy when new. Upgrading the chassis rigidity is a good idea. It provides a stable platform for your suspension build-up. You cannot have a chassis that is "too rigid," the stiffer the chassis the better.

    Mike Kojima on the benefits of a stiff chassis: Project Nissan 300ZX: Part 5 - Project Cars - Sport Compact Car Magazine
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car
    In any high-performance car, it is impossible to make the chassis too stiff. The stiffer the chassis, the higher its natural frequency, making the energy imparted to it by bumps less likely to excite the body's structure. A stiffer chassis enables the use of stiffer springs and shocks without hurting the ride. This is because a stiff, non-flexing chassis transfers more force into the suspension where it can be dissipated by the springs and shocks instead of transferring the force to the occupants. A stiff chassis is also more responsive to roll rate tuning for balancing understeer and oversteer. This is one of the reasons why automotive engineers are continually investigating ways to stiffen chassis without adding weight.
    2-Point FSTB options:

    Cusco - (Applications: B13, B14, N14, N15)
    Excellent quality two-point bar, very nicely engineered, rugged, stiff as hell. Requires slight extra installation work as some items need to be rearanged on the fire-wall to accomodate the bar.
    Group Buy thread: Cusco FSTB round 3 - SR20 Forum


    B13:

    Ballpark price: $140'ish in the Group Buy.

    BTW, that car pictured above belongs to forum member ~KnuckleDuster~. Yes, it is bad-ass.

    This will work on a B14? Yes, it will. Thank you Ameen!
    ATTN: B14 Guys, Everyone!!! the Cusco FSTB Fits!!! LOOK! - SR20 Forum
    From the thread above:
    Quote Originally Posted by Andreas Miko
    It will fit the N15. The N15 front is just like a B14

    This bar will fit all B13, B14, N14 and N15 cars.

    Some cars might need a slight modification to a fitting so alittle bending or shaving might have to be done.
    Nismo - Forum member viprdude (thank you sir) provided this website for "old skool" Nismo parts: Nismoparts.com - Your #1 Source for OEM Parts and Accessories
    Superb quality two point bar, what do you expect from Nismo?
    MSRP: $200.00
    Street price: $150'ish

    Courtesy - Sentra / NX (B13) 1991-1994 :: CourtesyParts.com
    Eerily similar to the E-bay bars.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbuls
    I currently have an E-Bay special (aka, Courtesy Nissan) FSTB on my NX. Compared to my Active Tuning RSTB it's a piece of sh*t and flexes under FAR less load......and it's chrome (polished aluminum)......I don't like chrome.
    E-bay FSTB - Cheap, crappy, flexy, looks kewl. I am not providing any more information on these bars. They exist.

    Stillen - No longer available. Excellent quality. Two point, flattish shaped bar, beefy aluminum, most commonly with the "Stillen" logo in the center. Very early bars may not have the logo. They sold for $169.00 when new, you may find one pre-owned in our Classifieds. A worthy pre-owned purchase.

    Jerryeads provides this photo of the Stillen bar:

    And yes, that is Jerry's extremely nice engine bay, complete with a VE.

    Whiteline - Whiteline Automotive - performance handling and suspension products. car spring coil shock damper swaybar sway bar anti-sway bush bushes australia australian whiteline automotive performance road holding turn-in camber caster toe in vehicle hot 4 v8
    Quote Originally Posted by hpro123 from later in this thread
    Whiteline FSTB and RSTB are of great quality and they do have (FOR A PRICE THOUGH) a nice touch. They sell an extra universal item, a FAST-ATTACH-DETACH thingy that lets you remove the brace from the Strut plates. I did check their catalog though today and they have removed A LOT of applications from their list, including the RSTB
    Triangulated FSTB - A three-point FSTB, connecting the two strut towers together and to the firewall is currently unavailable off the shelf.


    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car April 2005
    If the strut towers are so flexy that they need to be braced, though, how much sense does it make to brace a flexy strut tower to another flexy strut tower? Not much. We went the extra step, then, of bracing the strut towers to the firewall as well. This involved taking the (Ground Control) camber plates to a machine shop to have a slot cut in the rear corner for a Heim joint to attach. We then added an aluminum brace right above the stout pinch seam in the firewall and bolted two aluminum bars in place.

    This is a delicate operation. The mounting bolts must be short enough to keep from hitting the wiper mechanism inside the cowl, and the machine shop cutting on your camber plates has to understand what you're trying to do. It's a lot of work, but it makes a much bigger difference that the strut tower brace alone. (Author Dave Coleman)
    While what Dave says is true, keep in mind that a high-quality, commercially available two-point bar is much better than no strut brace.

    Excellent thread, Kojima and Andris: Strut Tower Brace that's worth a sh*t...... - SR20 Forum

    Another attempt at a 3-point FSTB. Chuck from Bolt-In-Bars, Shig from Shigspeed, and thanks to FORZWIN for this excellent discussion.
    http://www.sr20-forum.com/suspension...ated-fstb.html

    2-Point RSTB options:

    Active Tuning - Nissan Sentra Products - ActiveTuning

    (Application: B13 only)

    A burly-ass, extremely well built bar. Universally praised on the SR20Forum. Fit, finish, engineering, quality, strength, this bar kicks major ass. Installs behind the back seat, does not hamper use of the back seat.

    Benito Malito provided this excellent pic of the installed bar:

    Ballpark price: $100.00

    Bolt In Bars - Is a Forum Vendor. (Applications: B13 Classic and B14 only) Octotat makes an extremely well engineered, very stout, bad-ass RSTB for both the B13 Classic and B14. Both are unobtrusive, bolt into place, and are powder coated.
    Quote Originally Posted by Octotat on the B13 RSTB
    well i went and did it. after numerous requests, i finally designed a rstb for the b13's

    construction = 3/16th steel plate and .083 wall crossbar

    mig welded non-adjustable

    bolt in, no modification required

    provisions for future upgrades (harness bar, rollbar, bracing)

    cost = $135 shipped
    Quote Originally Posted by Octotat on the B14 RSTB
    B14 rear strut tower bar

    ....I decided it would be much easier to offer a lifetime money back guarantee on weld failure than debate how strong/worthy/bulletproof this bar is.

    specs:
    3/16ths cr steel plates
    1"x2"x.065 wall rectangular tubing
    weight = 4.5lbs
    powdercoated grey hammertone finish

    why is it better than a $25 ebay bar???
    -solid as a rock
    -mounts low, doesn't interfere with the passthrough
    -made in the usa
    Ballpark price: $100.00 see thread for details.

    Picture of the B14 Bolt In Bars RSTB stolen shamelessly from Killdannow, thank you sir:


    Picture of the B13 Classic Bolt In Bars RSTB:
    *****Not available at this time. Soon as it is, I'll post it.********

    Here's the Bolt In Bars (Octotat) Forum Vendors B13 RSTB thread:
    NEW PRODUCT ANOUNCEMENT!!!! B13 rear strut tower bars - SR20 Forum

    Here's the Bolt In Bars (Octotat) Forum Vendors B14 RSTB thread:
    b14 rear strut tower bars - SR20 Forum

    Cusco - Makes a bad-ass RSTB.

    Quote Originally Posted by jp314
    Cusco also makes a rear upper brace for the 91-94 Sentra - $$$$$ though
    You can buy it here:
    Nissan Performance Parts - Nissan Accessories
    Ballpark price: $225.00.

    Uh...wow on that price, might want to go back to the Active Tuning or Bolt In Bars RSTB. Both of which kick ass at a much better price.

    Whiteline - Whiteline Automotive - performance handling and suspension products. car spring coil shock damper swaybar sway bar anti-sway bush bushes australia australian whiteline automotive performance road holding turn-in camber caster toe in vehicle hot 4 v8 According to hpro123, the RSTB is no longer available. Bummer.
    Quote Originally Posted by hpro123 later in this thread
    Whiteline FSTB and RSTB are of great quality and they do have (FOR A PRICE THOUGH) a nice touch. They sell an extra universal item, a FAST-ATTACH-DETACH thingy that lets you remove the brace from the Strut plates. I did check their catalog though today and they have removed A LOT of applications from their list, including the RSTB
    Triangulated RSTB - Applications B13 only.

    Bolt In Bars - Is a Forum Vendor. They offer the only 3-point, triangulated, RSTB for the B13. It is absolutely bad-ass, over-engineered, stout as hell.

    Here is the current Group Buy thread, with links to all the other pertinent threads.
    B13 RSTB W/TRIAGULATOR GROUP BUY $250 SHIPPED - SR20 Forum


    IKEA brace - (Application: B13, B14, B15) Look up at the photo accompanying the Active Tuning RSTB. See that big-ass hole behind the seat, with that factory peice of plastic coated black OEM cardboard covering the hole? That is the hole that is covered by an IKEA brace. Crossreference additional photos below.

    grinch77 made one, measured it for us, and provided installed pictures. The sheet of steel is 17 1/2" by 22".
    From inside the trunk, the steel still needs to be cleaned up and painted, but you get the idea:

    From the inside of the car, thanks again grinch77:


    Isfahan chiming in with common sense engineering.
    Quote Originally Posted by Isfahan View Post
    FYI before putting in the IKEA brace. It might help to cut a bit out on the bottom where it covers the fuel pump cover. I need to get in there and having the IKEA brace right over the top really makes dealing with it quite difficult. I'm not sure how much this will reduce the effectiveness of the brace, but I would consider cutting along the red line to give a bit more room:

    Wish I'da thought of that before I had my IKEA brace installed in my Classic.

    Good discussion on the IKEA brace: My Ikea brace on the b13 - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car April 2005
    The final stiffener gets its inspiration from cardboard. I call it the IKEA brace, and it's modeled after the giant sheet of pressboard you nail to the back of a set of IKEA bookshelves. Before tacking on this flimsy sheet of glorified dryer lint, the shelves are so floppy they'll collapse if you look at the them sideways. But while the pressboard is easy to bend, it's nearly impossible to stretch or compress in the one direction that makes up the back of the shelf. Tack it down flat enough and it lends incredible strength to the shelf.

    The same should be true behind a Sentra's back seat. The giant rectangular hole in the back of the car sees large diagonal loads, but its rectangular shape is poorly equiped to deal with it. We cut a peice of 18-guage steel and tack welded it into the hole. (Author Dave Coleman).
    Last edited by Shawn B; 02-18-11 at 08:59 PM.
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  9. #9
    Techno Viking
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Louisiana
    Posts: 3,513
    Feedback Score: 14 (100%)

    Default

    Other Braces:

    Blehmco lower control arm brace - (B14 only) BlehmCo Suspension

    The thread from Himbo that brought it to my attention:
    Blehmco 4 Point LCA brace install and review - SR20 Forum

    NuTech lower control arm brace - No longer produced. Excellent quality, you would have to find one pre-owned.

    Progress LCA (lower control arm brace) - The Progress Group, Inc. Online Store
    Braces the control arms, three point attatchment. The steel brace sits up high behind the crossmember for excellent ground clearance.

    Ballpark price: $220.00 or so.

    (Closed) Progress Group Buy thread: Progress Coilovers, Swaybars, LCA braces - SR20 Forum

    Whiteline 4 pt. brace - Whiteline Automotive - performance handling and suspension products. car spring coil shock damper swaybar sway bar anti-sway bush bushes australia australian whiteline automotive performance road holding turn-in camber caster toe in vehicle hot 4 v8

    On the car:

    Whiteline Part Number: KSB713
    Part Name Lower Control Arm Brace - 4-Point Alloy
    Retail Price: $214.22
    Ballpark price: $162.00

    Good thread: Whiteline Brace for B13 - SR20 Forum

    Missing the hardware to install it? Thanks ~Knuckleduster~:
    Whiteline Control Arm Brace= Missing Hardware info - SR20 Forum

    (Closed) Group Buy thread: Whiteline 4pt. Control Arm Braces REDUX - SR20 Forum

    Traction bars - Generally designed to keep your control arms in place utilizing two seperate bars or braces. Typically these products are for drag racing applications.

    Hass makes traction bars. HASS Pro Turbo & Turbo Kits.com

    MSRP: $249.00 per set.

    A thread on traction bars with pics of the Hass units installed:
    Traction bar set up - SR20 Forum

    Hass traction bar thread:
    SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkSR20
    Traction bars

    Our traction bars are a new innovative way to deal with control arm deflection on FWD Nissan vehicles. Benefits are reduced wheel hop, increased stability in high power vehicles and increased traction at the drag strip with more consistent results. One of our customers recently made a 1.66” 60’ using these bars on small 22x8x15” MT slicks. To put that into perspective, the only other FWD Nissan recorded to attain a better 60’ was a drag prepped, wheelie bar shod, 9 second race car. (1.65 60’)

    The traction bars get rid of the need for control arm brace running across the underside of the car and interfering with down pipes and lowering ground clearance, but also can work with existing braces if you already have them. Control arms can also be preloaded during race conditions to help set up toe and your chassis to your liking.

    These bars do not bind, they do not limit steering travel, and they bolt to factory mounting points, there is no need for welding, drilling or any other type of modification. When not getting the holeshot on big slick RWD domestics you will not even know they are there.

    The bars are constructed out of durable aerospace grade aluminum hex stock, and use high quality spherical rod ends, with all of the mounting hardware included for a pain free installation.
    From the Hass traction bar thread (above), I am quite certain that this does not apply to the Hass units. However, a word of general caution on traction bars from Mike in this thread:
    What is 'wheel hop'? - SR20 Forum .
    Quote Originally Posted by Choaderboy2
    One thing is traction bars depending on how they are designed may cause bumpsteer. Lots of bumpsteer potentialy.
    Fender braces - A "fender brace" is going to brace the strut tower to the base of the "A" pillar by the door hinges. This will reinforce the strut tower itself, and tie together the front of the chassis with the structure of the car body. With a quality FSTB in place, this product would clearly "box in" the strut towers.

    Currently, no one manufactures these commercially for our B14, or B15 chassis. However, if you own a B13, you have one (1) option on Fender Braces.

    Stephens Fender Braces - Stephen also makes a very nice fender brace. Current (03/07) Group Buy on this product:
    fender braces - SR20 Forum
    Stephens product looks excellent.

    Stephens Fender Braces, photos courtesy of me, Shawn B.


    Sexy-ass antennae provision.


    Very clean work all the way around by Stephen. Nice end-cap on all ends.

    I love how the strut itself, Stephens Fender Brace, and the top of that Cusco bar all line up. Notice the door hinges bolt under the SFB (Stephens Fender Brace) and you can remove the hinge for maintenence. On the other end, the body metal itself is threaded, two (2) bolts tightened down, and the brace is welded in place. (Thanks Hank and Sal).



    Close up of SFB and hinges.


    Close up of welds and bolts permanently fastening the SFB to the front rail.


    Once again, I love the way everything lines up and you can clearly see how the front end is now boxed-in.


    Another angle on the "boxed-in" front end.



    Here's a DK Fabrications thread: DK-Fabrications Fender Braces !!!!!! - SR20 Forum

    Hammerin' Hank in another thread: Calling all Nissan chassis experts... - SR20 Forum


    Foam filling the chassis - Utilizing two-part catalytic urethane foam(s) to fill in part or all of the following: framerails, cross rail, front rails, ABC-pillars, and the channel surrounding the roof. The foam fills in the void and significantly increases the structural rigidity (40% plus stiffer) of the cavity/part being filled.

    Listen to 98sr20ve:
    Finally found the real Chassis Foam/Foamseal - SR20 Forum

    SCC's article on foam filling the chassis of Project Z: Project Nissan 300ZX: Part 5 - Project Cars - Sport Compact Car Magazine I edited it for content below.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car
    Foam-Filling the Chassis
    In a final bit of reengineering to stiffen the body, we injected the chassis with catalyzed rigid structural polyurethane foam. Structural foam, in the 2 lb per cubic foot density that we used, can stiffen chassis members up to 40 percent.

    Higher densities of foam can increase stiffness by up to 300 percent. Since we cannot retool custom parts to redo the Z's body, we figured that this would be an excellent, low-cost way of greatly increasing chassis stiffness. Injecting foam is not a new technique for chassis stiffening. The Infiniti Q45 uses this sort of foam in some of its chassis members to increase stiffness, as do a few other premium cars. In fact, the foam we chose is the foam recommended to repair damaged Q45s.

    To get the correct foam for our project, we contacted Art Goldman, Foamseal's automotive product manager and author of an SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) paper on the use of structural foam for the stiffening of automotive unibody structures. We used Foamseal's two-component foam kit, p/n 11-22 to fill the main members of the chassis. Like we mentioned earlier, Foamseal is the supplier that I-CAR, a national certification group for quality auto repair, recommends for the repair of damaged, foam-filled chassis. The Foamseal kit uses a two-part catalyzed polyurethane foam, which quickly cures into rigid, waterproof, closed-cell foam. To prep the car, we carefully masked off all painted areas anywhere where the foam could drip. As this sort of foam is a thermosetting catalyzed plastic, we realized it could be icky if it spilled on paint or any part of the car's interior. This foam is nasty stuff. It is impervious to all known solvents and cleaners.

    We were amazed at how this simple procedure improved the performance of the car. The chassis now almost feels like it has a roll cage. A sloped driveway can be driven up sideways with nary a creak. Even though the Z already has a pretty tight chassis, it feels more solid. The ride has improved and road noise has been reduced noticeably. We bet that the car will be even more responsive to chassis tuning measures in the future. If you are a slalom racer, a road racer, have a lowered car or even just want a smoother ride; foaming is a worthy, easy-to-do modification. Foamseal has foams in densities as high as 10 lbs per square foot if you desire to make things even stiffer.

    Do not--I repeat--do not attempt to use cheap, hardware-store canned foam. This is not the same thing, and if injected into your chassis, will form a gummy mass that won't dry. Foamseal foam is a professional grade foam, which although it is a little unforgiving to cleanup mistakes, has superior mechanical properties and catalytic curing so it will dry even in an enclosed space. (Author Mike Kojima).
    Shawn B (your humble author) decides to follow 98sr20ve and Mike K (Choaderboy2) into the land of foaming the vehicle chassis. A picture and information intensive thread utilizing two (2) types of foam product.
    http://www.sr20-forum.com/suspension...g-chassis.html


    Roll Bars and Roll Cages - There's a very good reason that most of the threads on rollbars are from the Motorsports section of the forum.

    This editorial is reasonably well put and covers the main points that you need to carefully consider before acquiring a cage or roll bar.
    Quote Originally Posted by Modified Mag October 2006
    It's pretty simple, roll cages are meant to protect you in the case of an accident. They reinforce the chassis and build a fortified skeleton around you so in the case of a large impact the driver is protected from being crushed, mangled or ejected. In many types of racing, roll cages are required only after a certain modification level or speed/time is hit. For example, in the NHRA drag racing rulebook it states that cars running 11.99 sec or quicker must have a roll cage installed.

    This makes a whole lot of sense - a ridiculously fast or track prepped car should have a proper cage, but what doesn't add up is the growing number of people installing bolt-in six or eight point cages in their street driven vehicles.

    Now, I'm not against a bolt-in cage in your ride but there are several things you need to consider before jumping into one. First and foremost, most bolt-in style roll cages are not great for head clearance as the bars running over the front door windows and down the A-pillars to the floor don't tend to fit all that snugly up against the interior of the car. It's not that these cages are poorly engineered, but the reality of fitting a partially assembled cage into a car is such that it has to be designed a little smaller than the interior space so that it goes in without too much drama. As such they pose a potential threat in the event of an accident where your head, when left unprotected by a helmet (remember we are talking about daily driving), impacts a bar, leaving you with a massive lump or even worse a head injury.

    If you are hell-bent on installing a full cage, whether for a show look or for the cool factor, you may want to consider having one custom built by a known/reputable shop that will ensure the bars are tucked up to the cars chassis as tightly as possible in order to provide as much head room as possible. Even so, always run high-density protective foam padding anywhere on the bars you think you could potentially ding your body off of. It may be cumbersome and not as visually appealing but it's much better than a crater in your head.

    The other option is to run a half a cage or a roll bar. These two types don't run any bars past the main hoop that is situated behind the front seats making them much safer for street use but still effective and ahem....cool. Of course if you want to carry passengers in the back seat, a roll bar can pose a similar threat to them as a full roll cage does to the front passenger, to keep that in mind too.

    The point of this editorial is not to dissuade you from installing a cage, rather to make sure you chose the right application. If your are serious enough about racing to and actually require a full cage, you should definitely have another car as a daily driver. But if you want some kind of roll over protection for a little weekend fun at the track or local autocross in your street car, do some research and seriously consider going with a half cage or roll bar that won't compromise the driver's compartment.

    Otherwise, you could potentially end up like a friend of mine that shall remain nameless, with a concussion from a 10 mph side swipe that without the roll cage would have cost him a new fender and door rather than a visit to the emergency room. (Author Peter Tarach)
    You may be wondering what the hell I am doing reading Modified Mag the ricer-zine. That issue contains Juniors "Sentra Supernova" article. He's a forum member, his car is uber-wicked and made it into a magazine, therefore I purchased a copy. It also happened to have that editorial on cages.

    SCC had this to say about roll cages:
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car June 2006
    MYTH #10: ROLL CAGES MAKE YOUR STREET CAR SAFER

    The Truth: This statement is only true if you are in a collision while wearing a helmet. In reality, welding or bolting in a multi-point cage is one of the most dangerous things you can do to your street car. Even if scrupulously designed and wickedly fabricated, cages are meant for race cars and drivers wearing helmets. Sure, a cage can dramatically improve chassis rigidity, but this huge increase also means that energy that supposed to be absorbed by crumple zones can now be directly transmitted to your body. In a high-impact collision, that sweet 4130 chromoly tubing can crack your unprotected head like a watermelon.

    Cages can also negatively inpact many of the esisting safety features found in newer cars. Passive safety restraints such as seat belts and active systems such as airbags are designed to work within a fixed amount of space and cannot account for the cabin intrusion of a safety cage. In fact, in newer cars, cage tubing can prevent the deployment of certain side curtain airbag systems. And we haven't even mentioned the injury potential of poorly designed cages of suspect strength and geometry.

    The Fix: Padding a rollcage can lessen the potential for injury, but unless you are willing to wear a helmet and 5-point harness to the grocery store - you're better off without one in your street car. (Author Edward Loh).
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car November 2006
    Most of you have seen a moron driving a car with a cage, a stock seat, and no rollbar padding. For those of you who weren't sure, we assure you that mild steel has more tensile strength than your skull. You should avoid driving on the street in a cage equipped car with no helmet. Also, when on the track, your helmet needs some help protecting you from the cage. NASA requires use of rollbar padding made of Ethafoam or Ensolite on any part that may come into contact with the driver. It recommends SFI 45.1 spec roll bar padding, so that is what we are using. (Author Matt Andrews)
    Excellent roll bar (and harness bar) thread with pics and discussion: New Roll Bar and Harness - SR20 Forum

    Bolt in Cage Pics Thread. Thanks Foster!
    Bolt-in cage pics? - SR20 Forum
    Mostly the Autopower bolted it, plus other links to more photos and information.

    I added the "NOTE" on each of these links to tell you what it was before you clicky.
    Quote Originally Posted by ~Knuckleduster~
    some cage links:

    NOTE: Southern California folks who build cages. Excellent photos:
    Roll Cage Builders? - SR20 Forum

    NOTE: Revenge Motorsports, California, builds cages.
    http://www.revengemotorsports.com/eventsmedia.html

    NOTE: Autopower Industries, California, builds cages.
    Autopower Industries

    NOTE: A totally kick-ass roll-bar thread, with pics, etc.
    Lets talk about roll bars - SR20 Forum
    Harness Bars - A horizontal bar that crosses the interior of the car just behind the seats. Typically mounting on the B pillars and/or floor. The bar is used as the anchor points for a three or four-point racing style harness.
    Quote Originally Posted by ~KnuckleDuster~
    Heres my harness bar. custom made, no specific brand. definatly cut down on some chassis flex. w/ camera mount. Cost was $125

    Excellent harness bar (and roll bar) thread with pics and discussion: New Roll Bar and Harness - SR20 Forum

    Forum vendor Bolt In Bars, Octotat, has the capability of making them. Harness Bars - SR20 Forum
    Last edited by Shawn B; 02-18-11 at 09:47 PM.
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  10. #10
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    VI. Sway Bars

    What the hell is a sway bar?- Front and rear, sway bars greatly affect your vehicles ride and dynamics. They help to reduce the vehicle leaning in the curves and therefore keep your tires planted on the road. They can help a car rotate properly, understeer less or not at all.

    This thread, courtesy of jrmnet, kicks major ass and tells you all about sway bars, with pictures:
    Moved to www.gwellwood.com

    Nissan OEM Stock Sway Bars - From the thread above:
    Sentra E 29mm (Hollow) front, 10mm (automatic only) rear
    Sentra XE, GXE, SE 29mm (Hollow) front, 10mm rear
    Sentra SE-R/NX2000 28mm (Solid) front, 15mm rear
    B14 - XXXX (will track these down)
    B15 - XXXX (will track these down)

    Intrax - Intraxsuspension - Welcome Polyurethane end links. Stock mounting points. Non-adjustable. Recommended to be used with the OEM FSB. This generic picture shows you both a front and rear Intrax sway bar:

    B13 Front Sway Bar: Intrax does not make one.
    B13 Rear Sway Bar: 19mm
    B13 MSRP: $229.00

    Nismo - See "Suspension Techniques." ST manufactured the parts for Nismo, they are ST bars. You'd be better off with Progress.

    NuTech - No longer produced. High quality, you would have to find one pre-owned.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car Magazine July 2000
    (NuTech Performance Suspension) They offer a 13/16-inch three-way adjustable anti-roll bar that is designed to work with the Suspension Techniques front bar. Like the Suspension Techniques rear bar (which is 3/4-inch), the NuTech rear bar uses the rear trailing link as a pickup point for the end links. (The stock end link pickups on the strut tubes have a tendency to break under heavy loads.) The end links of the the NuTech bar use heim joints instead of polyureathane bushings like the Suspension Techniques bar or rubber bushings like the stock bar. The Heim joints eliminate slop and prevent binding, ensuring that the bar's action is linear and predictable through-out the suspensions entire travel. At its softest setting, the NuTech bar is about the same stiffness as the Suspension Techniques bar.... (Author uncited, but Dave Coleman is in the picture piloting the SE-R).
    Progress - The Progress Group - Applications: B13 and B14.
    Thee best for your ride, three-way adjustable, with hiem link ends for no binding issues.
    Stock generic picture that includes Progress springs:

    Heim link ends for no binding:

    From this link: nissanperformancemag.com
    Quote Originally Posted by Nissan Performance Magazine
    Front and rear anti roll bars are also available for the B13/B14 Sentra/NX/200SX and the S13 240sx. The B13 sway bars are nothing new, but are a favorite amongst the Nissan community because of its proven performance. Extensive hours of track and race testing have demonstrated these sway bars to be the number one choice for SE-R cup racers. For both the S13 240sx and B13 Sentra and NX models, new race style links with spherical bearings replace the factory units to eliminate the squishy stock rubber bushings. These sway bars are also three way adjustable to meet the different demands of drift and grip racing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car April 2005
    The current state-of-the-SE-R-rear-bar-art is the the three-way adjustable 22mm bar from Progress....

    Using Heim joint instead of rubber or even polyurethane bushings offers two advantages. First, there's none of the deflection of rubber or poly, so every bit of suspension movement gets transferred to the bar. Second, the end links are adjustable in length. This lets you adjust them to fit the bar perfectly when the car is sitting on flat ground, ensuring that the bar isn't pre-loading the suspension one direction or the other. (Author Dave Coleman)
    Front Sway Bar 30mm.
    MSRP: $289.00
    Sells for: $230'ish

    Rear Sway Bar 22mm.
    MSRP: $289.00
    Sells for: $230'ish

    Replacement hiem end-links, thank you Toolapcfan:
    Where to get replacement heims for Progress swaybars - SR20 Forum

    How to install, what it looks like, thank you mpg9999:
    Progress rear sway bar, installed - SR20 Forum

    (Closed) Progress Group Buy thread: Progress Coilovers, Swaybars, LCA braces - SR20 Forum

    Suspension Techniques - Non-adjustable. Standard polyurethane end links, have been known to bind in particular in the front of the car (Per Slartitbartfast....XXXX will re-find thread). Solid steel, powdercoated, well built unit.

    91-94 Nissan Sentra 1 3/16" DiameterFront Bar
    Part #: 50125
    MSRP: $191.91
    Sells for: $160'ish

    91-94 Nissan Sentra 3/4" DiameterRear Bar
    Part #: 51105
    MSRP: $191.91
    Sells for: $160'ish

    91-94 Nissan Sentra Diameters: Front (1 3/16") Rear (3/4") Front/Rear Set
    Part #: 52125
    MSRP: $363.99
    Sells for: $300'ish

    Whiteline - Whiteline Automotive - performance handling and suspension products. car spring coil shock damper swaybar sway bar anti-sway bush bushes australia australian whiteline automotive performance road holding turn-in camber caster toe in vehicle hot 4 v8
    Has all kinds of stuff for the N14 (B13) and B14 chassis, including swaybars.

    B13 Front: 27mm
    MSRP:
    Sells for:

    B13 Rear: 18mm adjustable
    MSRP:
    Sells for:

    B14 Front: 27 mm
    Part number: BNF22
    MSRP: $214 Australian
    Sells for:

    B14 Rear: 20 mm
    Part number: BNR21
    MSRP: $214 Australian
    Sells for:
    Last edited by Shawn B; 02-18-11 at 09:52 PM.
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  11. #11
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    VII. Camber Kits

    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)

    What the hell is camber? - Good question. From this web-site: TurnFast! • Glossary
    Quote Originally Posted by Turnfast.com from link
    Camber-- looking at the front of a car, imagine the top of the wheel tipped inward so the top is closer to the vehicle center than the bottom. This angle is called camber. If the top of the wheel is tipped inward, it is called negative camber. If the top of the wheel is tipped outward it is called positive camber. If the wheel is straight it is called zero camber. Maintaining zero camber provides the largest contact patch, however during cornering, the tires roll decreasing contact patch, and the suspension geometry changes which further reduces the contact patch. To counteract this, a car set up for maximum cornering grip usually has a small amount of negative camber from 3/4 of a degree for street/track setups to as much as 3 degrees for dedicated race cars. Too much camber reduces traction during braking (and accelerating for a FWD car).
    From here, sentra.net
    NOTE: Understand that some information contained in that link is...dated. This article was written by Mike before Hyperco, let alone Road Magnet springs. You have to view some of the information, specifically on commercially available springs (H&R, Eibach) and products (NuTech is out of business), in that article with a historical perspective. However, all of the rest of the info is dead accurate today, still very relevant, and it's brilliant. Like this for instance:
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kojima
    Having adjustably is good. Having the ability to adjust shocks, camber and toe is very useful when trying to extract G’s from your car. On a showroom stock racer I was working on, optimizing the alignment and tire pressures alone made the car go from 0.79 to 0.86 g’s on the skidpad and 3 seconds a lap faster at Willow Springs. As front camber is not adjustable on our cars it is important to make it so. Stillen, Cusco and Ground Control make high quality camber plates, the Ground Control being the best of these as they give you 1/2" more wheel travel and the ability to adjust caster. Camber Plates will slightly harshen your ride but will sharpen turn in due to the elimination of squishy rubber with metal bearings. Rear camber adjustably is not critical on most FWD cars. If you are on a tight budget and cannot afford camber plates, you can use The Poor Boy Method for adjustable camber! To make poor boy adjustable camber, you can drill out one of the two strut to spindle bolt holes on the strut housing by about 1/16" This will get you a couple of degrees of camber adjustment. Camber bolts or crash bolts as they are sometimes called should not be used as they slip under high load. If you are racing Solo II stock class or Showroom stock and don’t want to cheat, you can get about ˝ degree more negative camber by loosening all of the suspension bolts and having someone hold the wheel in the negative position while you retighten everything. When adjusting camber, be sure to reset your toe adjustment as it will also change when you adjust camber.
    Now that we know what camber is, lets look at hardware to adjust it on a B13 vehicle.

    Camber bolts or "crash bolts" - A few companies make "kits", Eibach, Whiteline, Ingalls, etc..... Pretty lame way to adjust camber, it will shift under heavy load. If you are serious about autocross or road racing, you will buy a set of camber plates.

    Here's a good thread on camber or crash bolts:
    camber bolts anyway had/have these? - SR20 Forum
    Pay attention to BigB and Jerryeads.
    Here's another:
    camber adjustment - SR20 Forum

    Cusco - 404?????????????????????????
    empower99 provided these excellent photos, thank you Fred:



    Quote Originally Posted by Cusco web-site in link
    PILLOW BALL UPPER MOUNT
    FEATURES
    Controls unwanted forces under acceleration
    and braking
    Common to both center look and camber adjustable type improves steering response and performance. Stable steering response in esesse and lane changing improved stability over bumps and holds roll in corners. Enables linear handling and keeps you on the record line better. Stability and safety during turn-ins and under braking.
    SPECIFICATION
    Available for both center lock and camber adjustable types
    6mm thick plate made from 2017S heat treated aircraft grade aluminum.
    Various pillow collars available to suit your needs.
    CAMBER ADJUSTMENT
    Camber adjustable by sliding the plate and
    pillow ball sections
    Quote Originally Posted by empower99
    The average price for Cusco mounts is $250. The lowest price I've seen them is $230 (which is what I paid), the highest is the Stillen rebadged plates at $270.
    Ground Control - Ground Control - Street and race suspension systems for your car.

    Ground Control camber plates work with coilover springs only. They do not work with Nissan stock or direct replacement springs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ground Control website
    More camber adjustment than stock, caster adjustment, aircraft bearings, engraved with calibrated degrees, with stainless steel reinforcement. Every component is anodized or plated, including fasteners. Adds extra travel to avoid excessive bottoming out, this is a very well engineered product. The stainless steel reinforcement prevents electrolysis between the steel fender and the aluminum camber plate.
    Camber and caster are separately adjustable by sliding the mounts, without removing any components from the car. The priority of this design is to allow fast, repeatable alignment changes at the track.
    The Ground Control camber plates feature two sets of bearings, a proprietary bearing, made to our specs by Aurora in the USA, which allows for articulation of the shock shaft. This spherical bearing is very understressed, as the Ground Control design does NOT support the weight of the car on the spherical bearing. Instead, the weight of the car is supported by a completely separate articulating needle bearing, which is also manufactured for Ground Control in the USA

    MSRP: $349.00 per set.


    Ingalls - Modern Engineering & Modern Technology for Modern Performance Vehicles - Ingalls Engineering Co., Inc.
    This is slightly over my head. However, it allows you to adjust the camber in the rear of the B13 chassis. Cusco, Ground Control, and Stillen plates are for the front end.
    Quote Originally Posted by SE-R_Dan later in this thread
    These Ingalls rear parallel (radius) arms allow rear camber adjustment on the B13. They're also tubular and much stronger than the stock sheetmetal
    From this thread: B13 Rear Camber Adjustment - SR20 Forum

    This product and thread is beyond my limited grasp, however if you consider these aftermarket radius arms you probably know a lot more than I do. This was posted in the "Autocross, Rally, & Road Racing" section of the forum for a reason.

    What else can I do to adjust rear camber? This thread answers your question:
    rear camber - SR20 Forum


    Stillen - Re-badged Cusco units. No longer available from Stillen. Check the forum classifieds for pre-owned product.
    Last edited by Shawn B; 02-18-11 at 09:54 PM.
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  12. #12
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    VIII. A Few Words About Wheels & Tires

    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)

    Thee single most dramatic thing you can do to improve your suspension is to upgrade your wheel and tire combination.

    Unsprung weight - Consists of anything not supported by the springs. Your tires, wheels, and brakes make up the majority of unsprung weight. You want to minimize unsprung weight.

    How to do your own alignment - You just put on your new suspension. Now go get it aligned at a reputable shop.

    Another option is to do it yourself. 98sr20ve conducting class, please pay attention: How to do your own Alignment. - SR20 Forum

    How are wheel width and diameter measured?



    What size wheels should I buy? Your best performance bet is 15" lightweight wheels. 4 X 100 pattern, you have a bazillion choices for the B13 chassis. Tires are less expensive for the 15" wheel size.

    16" rims may look cool, but tire selection is extremely limited.

    17" (+) wheels suck for performance, it is more unsprung weight. More expensive tires. If you go bigger than 17" rims on a B13? Prepare to be flamed for being a total Uncle Ben's Ricer.

    From this link: sentra.net
    NOTE: Understand that some information contained in that link is...dated. This article was written by Mike before Hyperco, let alone Road Magnet springs. You have to view some of the information, specifically on commercially available springs (H&R, Eibach, etc.) and products (NuTech is out of business, etc.), in that article with a historical perspective. However, all of the rest of the info is dead accurate today, still very relevant, and it's brilliant. Like this for instance:
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kojima
    Don’t over tire or wheel your car. Our cars will go the fastest and handle best with the widest, lightest 15 inch wheel that will fit. 16, 17 and 18 inch wheels which look radical, really slow the car down because they are heavy and the bigger diameter screws up the gear ratio.... The widest tire that you should run unless you have a turbo or some other ungodly power is a 205. Wider tires will result in more drag than our relatively low power engines can accelerate. A 205/50-15 works well in most cases and a wide variety of R compound tires are available in this size. The maximum rim width that the B14/B15 can run is 7.5 inches with a 35-40 mm offset. A Classic B13 can run a 7-inch rim with a 30-35 mm offset as there is less wheel clearance in the rear of a B13. Since this always comes up, the bolt circle measurement on our wheels is 4x100 mm. The competition wheel that impresses me the most is the Volk TE37. This wheel is forged so it can be much thinner than a cast type wheel. It weighs a feathery 9 lbs which is twice as light as a regular wheel. The other good light wheel is the Enkei RPO-1 it weighs about 13 lbs which is still very light. Remember that 1 lb on the wheel is worth about 10 on the car due to the wheels rotational Inertia. We took 0.4 seconds off of Mike Saiki’s Ľ mile time just by going from 16 inch Axis wheels to 15 inch TE37’s. The difference is all in the wheel weight and tire diameter.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car June 2006
    MYTH #9: BIG WHEELS MEAN BIG PERFORMANCE

    The Truth: Remember when you first moved up from a BMX bike to full-size mountain bike? Remember how hard it was to pedal? Gear ratio aside, it takes a lot more work to accelerate a larger diameter wheel because of the added rotational inertia. Rotational inertia (how difficult an object is to start or stop spinning) is affected by mass and radius. In the case of a wheel, the radius has an exponentially larger effect on rotational inertia than wieght alone. For example, the one inch difference in diameter between a 17- and 18-inch wheel has the same effect on the wheel's rotational inertia as increasing its weight by 10 percent at the outer radius. The effect is even greater going from an 18- to a 19-inch wheel.

    Bigger wheels also weigh more. Although unsprung weight (any vehicle weight not held up by the suspension) isn't such a significant factor on the street, at the track, taking as much weight as possible off each corner will have a huge impact on lap times. The math reveals that every pound of unsprung weight is equivalent to adding 1.4 or more pounds to the chassis (sprung weight). As with rotational inertia, this effect is amplified as the wheel diameter increases.

    The Fix: We don't like anything larger than 18 inches in diameter. For most smaller sport compacts, 17-inch wheels are more than enough. Look for the lightest, widest wheels that clear your suspension and fenders. If price is a limitation, sacrifice weight before width. A wide wheel means more tire and grip, but also more mass at the outer radius and therefore more roatational inertia. There is always a tradeoff. (Author James Chen).
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car August 2006
    The 16X7-inch Black Racing N1 wheels we installed last century (1997) were reasonably light for cast wheels at 15 pounds each, but years of abuse had turned them square. It was time for a change.

    Visually, 16's are the right size for an SE-R, but the selection of 16-inch tires is pathetic. 17's look like dubs on a B13, so we went down to the land of lightweight and abundant race rubber. The land of 15's.

    Every good tire is available in 205/50/15, and 15X6.5 and 15X7-inch wheels are abundant in the bolt pattern (4X100mm) and offset (+35mm) the SE-R requires. (Author Dave Coleman)
    Check this thread for wheel weights:wheel weights - 3000+ brands - SR20 Forum It links you to a web-site that lists wheel weights for 3,000+ rims.

    Conversion Tables for Rims and Tires You want to +1 your rim size and keep your speedometer as accurate as possible? Thank you Canx2k for this excellent thread:
    Conversion table for bigger rims/tires - SR20 Forum

    Where should I buy tires? Well, you should always check Tire Rack. They offer great service, support, pricing, and an uber-cool web-site: Tires Their web-site allows you to view different rims on your vehicle. Their tire buying process has tons of information and reviews on tires.

    How old are my tires, even when new? Yes, tires have a have a shelf-life.
    http://www.sr20-forum.com/offtopic/1...new-tires.html
    Thanks to forum member 97 SR20 for that information. And for sr20jet for the Reader's Digest version:
    Quote Originally Posted by sr20jet
    Look at the series of DOT numbers on the tire. Look at the last set of numbers, this will indicate when the tires were produced. In my case, 2208 meaning tires were made on the 22nd week of 2008. If it's 3 digits, the last digit goes back to the 1990's, ex. 077 tires made on 7th week of 1997.
    Further, according to an ABC News report in the thread link, tires can start to deteriorate at the four (4) year mark, and become dangerous at the six (6) year mark. However, tires have no "expiration date" at the tire dealers. Make sure you are buying relatively new tires and not a tire that has been sitting on a shelf somewhere for five (5) years.

    Stock OEM wheel information for the B13 and B14. What is the size, offset, bolt pattern, center bore, weight, and how does changing my rims change my speedometer accuracy?
    Tire Wheel Sizes
    Gracias to forum member jrmnet for this kick-ass link.

    How much tire and wheel can I stuff under my B13, B14, B15?

    The Official Wide Tire (205+) Thread:
    The official wide tire (205+) thread - SR20 Forum
    The biggest tire you can run on a FWD vehicle thread:
    Whats the biggest tire you run on your FWD car? - SR20 Forum
    Toolapcfan wants a 15X8 wheel thread:
    15x8 on a B13, what offset? Spacers? - SR20 Forum
    Zerogravity wants to stuff a 15X8 wheel under his car also:
    Test FIt:15x8 with +20 & +40 offset - SR20 Forum
    Coach wants to stuff Slipstreams under his ride. Also, good information and discussion on offset.
    Anyone look at the 7.5" WIDE Slipstream - SR20 Forum
    JKho provided this link, to compare your current wheels to the wheels you are contemplating to see what will fit:
    http://www.bigcustomwheels.com/info_specs.jsp
    Here's Montys ride:
    Quote Originally Posted by McCoy
    Here is what the 225/45/15 Hoosiers look like on my sentra with the 30mm offset and 8mm spacers used to clear the struts in the rear. No fender massaging has been done yet to my car, I just run the car high enough to keep the fenders off the tires.


    Which tires are SR20-Forum Members running on their street or track cars, and what is their opinion on the tires?
    From Cliff, this thread covers all the Forum Member reviews of tires in great detail. "The Definitive Tire Thread."

    http://www.sr20-forum.com/suspension...re-thread.html

    Upgrading your wheel studs and lug nuts.
    http://www.sr20-forum.com/suspension...nded-lugs.html

    Why in the hell are B14 OEM SE-R rims so damn popular on B13's?
    a) The "deli slicer" B13 14" OEM rims always looked a little....aesthetically questionable at best.
    b) The 15" B14 rims are a handsome classic 5-spoke design that will never be dated. They look fantastic on Classics, and damned good on N2K's.
    c) Excellent and inexpensive tire selection, more rubber on the road. 195/50/R15 or 205/50/15 tires are abundant.
    d) Fancy wheels attract thieves, B14 rims do not.
    Last edited by Shawn B; 06-14-12 at 03:04 PM. Reason: Adding wheel size measuring image.
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  13. #13
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    IX. Limited Slip Differentials

    (Applications: B13, B14, B15)

    Why include LSD's in a suspension thread? Well, if you can't get your power to the ground, your suspension is irrelevant.

    What the hell is a differential?
    Quote Originally Posted by Autotrader Glossary
    Limited-Slip Differential
    A device that helps prevent the drive wheels from skidding or losing traction by diverting power from the slipping wheel to the opposite wheel on the same axle
    Quote Originally Posted by How To Build Performance Nissan Sport Compacts, 1991-2006
    An LSD applies torque to the wheel spinning the slowest. If one wheel loses traction, power is transferred to the other wheel. (HP Books, author Sarah Forst)
    More in depth explanation on differentials: HowStuffWorks "How Differentials Work"

    Types of LSD's

    Viscous LSD - Here, let SCC explain it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car May 2004
    Viscous - A type of limited-slip differential. A viscous limited slip connects the driveshafts of the driven wheels with alternating plates immersed in a thick, snot-like, fluid. When all the plates are turning the same speed, the snot is just there for the ride. When one tire slips, there's a speed difference between the plates. This speed difference causes the snot to grab the slower-spinning plates to accelerate them to the same speed as the faster-spinning ones, thus transferring torque to the wheel with grip. (Author Jason Kavanagh)

    This is the most complete description of limited slip differentials I have ever found. Authors note: go buy the book quoted, it is brilliant, comprehensive, and full of information.
    Quote Originally Posted by How To Build Performance Sport Compacts, 1991-2006

    Viscous LSD - A viscous LSD uses a series of stacked slotted discs attatched to the ends of each axle shaft with silicon fluid between them. When one wheel loses grip, the discs coupled to that wheel will rotate quicker than the others. This causes friction between the two discs and heats up the silicone fluid. The silicone expands and pushes the discs together, locking them and transferring more power to the wheel with grip. Most stock Nissan limited-slip differentials are the viscous type. Viscous limited-slip differentials are smooth but not as great at transferring power.

    Mechanical LSD - A mechanical limited-slip differential transmits torque to the slower spinning wheel by using a spring-loaded or cam-actuated multi-plate clutch between the axles. The cams mount in the differential over the pinion shafts and apply a wedging force to the clutch plates when the axles spin at different speeds. Mechanical LSD's can be the most efficient but they can also be noisy and rough in operation. Most aftermarket LSD's, including the ones offered by Phantom Grip, are the mechanical clutch-type. The cam-actuated clutch-type differentials can be classified as 1-way, 1.5-way, and 2-way, as determined by the cam profile. The 1-way differentials work during acceleration. The 1.5-way differntials work slightly when the car is braking as well. A 1-way or 1.5-way works best on FWD cars or cars not intended for hard-core road racing. The 2-way differentials work during acceleration and braking. Two-way differentials work best for drag racing, hardcore road racing on high-powered cars, and for drifting.

    Helical Gear LSD - The final type of differential is the helical gear, which uses longer angled teeth that can mesh tow unparallel shafts. Helical differentials eploit the fact that a spur gear can turn a worm gear, but not vice versa, to provide the locking action. They are very smooth in operation, have good locking capacity, and distribute torque to the wheels the best way to improve your car's ability to turn. The QR25DE-powered Spec V comes with a stock helical limited-slip differential. Quaife no longer produces their helical limited-slip differential for the SR20DE-powered B13 or B14 with stock viscous limited slip, but they can be found used. The Quaife unit can be installed on the open differential-equipped cars too, but it must be paired with the viscous coupling to make it work. The viscous units use bigger side case bearings with a different transmission case.

    The SR20DE-powered B13 and 1995-1997 B14, B15 Sentra SE, and G20 "T" model come with a stock viscous limited-slip differential. The stock VLSD will eventually wear out. Autocross courses and many track days will break down the viscous fluid. The 1991-1996 Infiniti G20 (P10) standard trim models (non-T) came with an open differential. Phantom Grip offers clutch-type limited-slip differentials for the P10, as well as the B13 and B14, both the SR20DE- and GA16DE-equipped models. The Nissan Motorsports VLSD has 20% more lockup than the stock differential. Nismo also offers two clutch-driven 1.5-way mechanical limited-slip differentials for the SR20DE equipped cars, one for use with cars already equipped with the stock viscous limited-slip differential, and one for use with cars with an open differential.
    (HP Books, author Sarah Forst)
    Let me repeat, you should go buy "How To Build Performance Nissan Sport Compacts, 1991-2006" author Sarah Forst, published by HP books.

    JGY - Nissan, 240sx, nissan sentra, nissan sentra se-r, G20, nissan skyline gtr, nissan silvia, S13

    Quote Originally Posted by JGY Website
    JGY Customs Friction type LSD for trannsmissions with VLSD or open diff. Available in Street or Drag versions. - $219 Now availble for 1.6L transmissions - Instock!
    NOTE: JGY is on the Vendor Blacklist on all SR20 Community Web-sites. He has about a 50% Customer Satisfaction Rating. Let me put that another way, you have a 50% chance of being pissed-off, ripped off, or disgusted with JGY. BUYER BEWARE.

    Nismo - This is a clutch type 1.5 way limited slip differential (LSD). Forum member viprdude provided this link for "old skool" Nismo parts, including the LSD:
    Nismoparts.com - Your #1 Source for OEM Parts and Accessories

    From this thread: Quaife Differential - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by McCoy
    I paid under $700 for my Nismo LSD... for a vlsd tranny. The Nismo LSD for the non-vlsd tranny is $1000.

    After doing it, I feel that this is one of my better investments for track usage
    From this thread: Nismo LSD Review/Comments - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by McCoy
    1. - I did not buy the bearings, but I also had a local tranny shop swap the LSD and they were able to reuse my bearings from the LSD. If you were to do this yourself, you would probably want to order up the bearings.

    Parts list of what I ordered...
    02N/38431-D2100 STOPPER SPEEDOM
    02N/32701-70E00 GEAR-DRIVE,SPEE
    02N/38420-RS365US DIFFERENTIAL AS

    The bearings that you might need...
    02N/31408-31X08 BEARING-DIFFERE
    02N/38440-D2100 BEARING-SHAFT L

    2. - No, I talked to a few forum members about this and they also did not have to do this.

    3. - A hell of alot better than the stock one. On the track I was able to spin the inside tire in tight 2nd-gear corners (T25+S3 cams) with the stock LSD. With the Nismo LSD I am able to accelerate out of these corners without spin and am able to get on the power much sooner giving me a better exit speed than I ever had before
    .

    From this thread: NISMO LSD review by Mike Kojima! - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kojima
    Ok, I finaly got to test the Nismo clutch type 1.5 way LSD at the SE-R cup race at California Speedway this weekend. The diff was installed in the dog car and I ran it with some sucess in the weekends race.

    At first the diff felt a little weird, contributing to a lot of pull and torque steer, fortunately this lasted only about a session and as the diff broke in, the pulling became unoticeable after 15 minutes of race conditions.

    The Nismo diff uses clutch plates activated by a cam device that goes on the spider gear pins, when the wheels try to spin at different rates the spider gears transmit the differental force to the cames which apply a clamp load to the cluch packs. The Nismo diff also has 4 spider gears vs 2 like the stock diff for additonal strength as this is the weakest part of the stock diff.

    Nismo sells two diffs, one to fit on trannys with a VLSD and another one to convert non LSD trannys like 98-99 trannys and G20's to limited slip.

    The diff completly eliminated inside wheel spin on this track which had very tight and slippery corners. Unlike the Quaife differential, the Nismo unit still provided plenty of drive when one wheel was in the air, like when I was banging off FIA curbs.

    The Nismo diff also helped to prevent the inside front wheel from locking up under heavy braking, even from 130 mph. This enabled me to brake late more
    consistantly.

    The diff did not hurt turn in like I feared it would but did not have that neat pull into a turn feeling that a Quaife has.

    I think I like this diff more than a Quaife, it provides drive force when one wheel is in the air, helps under braking and is much stronger. The only thing a Quaife does better is turn-in under throttle.

    This diff is cheaper than the Quaife was and best yet, its avalible for sale!
    Another very good thread on the Nismo unit, gives you a ballpark on total cost installed:
    NISMO lsd *total* cost, advice - SR20 Forum

    Nissan OEM - VLSD

    Phantom Grip - Phantom Grip - Get a Grip! Limited Slip Conversion Kits

    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Grip website
    The Phantom Grip LSD, otherwise knows as Limited Slip Differential, conversion kit, installs into your non-lsd differential converting it into a proven and competitive limited slip differential that enhances your traction needs. It serves two distinctive functions for the daily driver, street/strip warrior, or full race vehicle. In cornering and braking, it functions as a disc-type limited slip. In hard acceleration, the Phantom Grip works as a locker causing both wheels to receive equal power instead of just one wheel spin.

    Every Phantom Grip is constructed of only the highest-quality aerospace alloys. With over 500,000 miles of vigorous performance testing (SCCA, drag, rally, hill climb, ice, rain, etc.), we have been able to fine tune each application through specific heat treating and rockwell testing to achieve maximum performance and reliability. Each Phantom Grip unit is assembled with blueprinted matched sets of progressive-rate springs to achieve equal load distribution to the disc plates, which dramatically enhances reliability and performance.
    From this thread: Phantom Grip LSD - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Kojima
    Follow the link to the instrumented tests done by NPM. Data talks, opinions walk.

    The Phantom grip works very well as an assist to a worn out stock VLSD. On its own on an open diff car like a G20 or a 98 SE or SE-R, it works like a VLSD when its shimmed with the compitition spring kit. Without the springs, its like a worn out stock VLSD, which is still way better than nothing.

    When combined with a stock VLSD, its a nice alternative to a more expensive unit. I used to run the Phantomgrip on my SE-R cup car but have since switched to a Nismo clutch type 1.5 way diff. INHO this works better than a quaife as it still provides traction when one wheel is in the air and helps prevent inside wheel brake lock up.

    Quaife still turns in a little better.

    This is real information from people who have really used them.
    Nissan Performance Magazine:
    nissanperformancemag.com

    Nissan Performance Magazine again:
    nissanperformancemag.com

    Excellent thread: Phantom grip vs jgy lsd - SR20 Forum

    Quaife - AUTOTECH - Quaife Torque Biasing Differentials, Close Ratio Gearkits, Racing Transmissions, Custom Driveline Components

    Quote Originally Posted by Quaife website
    The Quaife Differential powers both drive wheels under nearly all conditions, instead of just one. With an ordinary open differential, standard on most cars, a lot of precious power is wasted during wheelspin under acceleration. This happens because the open differential shifts power to the wheel with less grip (along the path of least resistance). The Quaife, however, does just the opposite. It senses which wheel has the better grip, and biases the power to that wheel. It does this smoothly and constantly, and without ever completely removing power from the other wheel.

    In drag-race style, straight-line acceleration runs, this results in a close to ideal 50/50 power split to both drive wheels, resulting in essentially twice the grip of an ordinary differential (they don't call open diffs "peglegs" for nothing).

    In cornering, while accelerating out of a turn, the Quaife biases power to the outside wheel, reducing inside-wheel spin. This allows the driver to begin accelerating earlier, exiting the corner at a higher speed.

    The Quaife also controls loss of traction when the front wheels are on slippery surfaces such as ice and snow or mud, providing the appropriate biased traction needed to overcome these adverse conditions. The Quaife Differential provides constant and infinitely variable drive. Power is transferred automatically without the use of normal friction pads or plates seen in other limited-slip designs.

    The Quaife's unique design offers maximum traction, improves handling and steering, and puts the power where it is needed most. A definite advantage whether on the track or on the street.

    The Quaife is extremely strong and durable and since the Quaife is gear operated, it has no plates or clutches that can wear out and need costly replacement.

    The Quaife is great for street driving or racing. Racers don't have to put up with locking mechanisms or spools that created unwanted understeer under power, or in the case of front-drive cars, even tear the steering wheel out of their hands when cornering. Because it behaves like an open differential during ordinary driving, street drivers will have trouble telling it's there until pushing the car's limits.

    The Quaife has been proven in everything from SCCA Rally to Formula 1. It provides autocrossers with such an advantage, it has become "required" equipment for a winning effort.

    More and more auto manufacturers are specifying the Quaife ATB Differential as original equipment in their high performance models - for good reason - it works!

    The Quaife ATB Differential comes with something else other's don't have: a Limited Lifetime Warranty. This warranty applies even when raced !
    98sr20ve tells you how to install a Quaife: Pics from Quaife install - SR20 Forum

    From this thread: Overwhelming disappointment with Nismo LSD, or, Learn from my ignorance (long) - SR20 Forum
    Quote Originally Posted by autoxer7
    I was going to say something about you needing a new bearing and speedo gear but someone had already mentioned it... alas, in another thread. Nismo LSD installation. - SR20 Forum

    I know when I did my Quaife install a new bearing and speed gear were recommended for the install. Here's an old thread that mentions the parts: pics of prepped Quaife - SR20 Forum

    I really love my Quaife. Ask all those guys behind me on the track at the '02 Nat Convention in AZ... I could pull a couple car lenghts in those tight corners on the "oval." I hope you reconsider installing the Nismo unit.
    From this thread: Best differential for Loose surface (Rally) - SR20 Forum
    Not one but two uber-brainiacs chime in on differentials.
    Quote Originally Posted by BigToe
    The ATB is Automatic Torque Biasing. It's a Gleason Torsen Differential, used by almost all of the high dollar sports cars out of Japan and Europe.
    The torque at the wheels contact patch changes as a function of the load and traction on the contact patch, if the wheel is slipping all it has is a torque value equal to the total friction of the slipping assembly. If the other wheel has traction it has a torque value equal to the total friction at that wheel. In other words, one wheel slipping (say off the ground) the other not then you have 100% of the output torque consumed at the wheel or; x=0, y=100. The gear arrangement allows the torque distribution from the pinion shaft through to the axle halves to infinitely vary while allowing differential axle velocity in a theoretical ratio of 0:100 and vice versa.
    A plate type LSD cannot do this.
    Once the plate type assembly sees rotational velocity (round a corner or one wheel slipping) the torque differential across the axles result in a twisting force across the diff case via the spider gear assembly which is mechanically converted in to a compression load of the clutch pack, forcing the axle with the lower torque value (higher velocity) to slow down to the speed of the higher torque (lower velocity) axle. Hence the Plate type clutch is a differential velocity devise and not a torque biasing device. It's like an of off switch.
    The VLSD sorts the problem of a clutch type assembly because it locks up based on shear stress of a viscous fluid as the shear rate increases (velocity or speed differential). It is therefore alot more progressive, allows for a bit of a dimmer switch effect than an on off effect, is cheaper and does not creek and grunt like a clutch type. Perfect for a mass produced OEM unit. Problem is as temperature increases the shear stress to shear rate ratio changes. The shear stress being the mechanism that transfers the torque to the plates and onto the axles. As temperature increases, the shear stress reduces as the shear rate increases. This is a rheological fluid dynamic that can be described by basic models: Newtonian Fluids, Bingham Plastics, Power Law or pseudo plastic fluids. I would guess without testing the silicone fluid that the best fitting model would be the Power Law.
    Mike has this to say:
    Quote Originally Posted by choaderboy2
    I think the Nismo 1.5 way is the best and cheapest off the shelf solotion. The Quaife does not work too well. It allows inside wheelspin and acts like an open diff when a wheel is in the air...
    Group Buy thread: Quaife LSD / ATB Differential - Group Buy - SR20 Forum

    From the Tech Libarary: Disassembly of B15/P11 tranny/install of friction type LSD - SR20 Forum
    Last edited by Shawn B; 03-26-10 at 05:38 AM.
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    X. Glossary of Suspension Terms

    (Applications: Any car you own.)

    You don't know what the hell "understeer" really means? Check out the following web-sites:

    The best one, from B13magoo later in this thread, Car & Driver:
    http://www.caranddriver.com/glossary...f-terms.html#a

    Turnfast:
    http://www.turnfast.com/refc_glossary/glossary.shtml

    Autotrader:
    http://www.autotrader.com/help/glossary.jsp

    Oddballautoparts:
    http://www.oddballautoparts.com/Auto..._Parts_A_F.htm
    Last edited by Shawn B; 07-08-09 at 10:57 AM.
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    XI. Recommended Set-ups

    I am going to actually apply what is written up in this thread and give you some basic suspension outlines that will work. There are too many variables to consider with each individual person and their start-point. Existing suspension, mechanical expertise, budget, etc..... Therefore, tailor these general recommendations to your specific uses and performance expectations. These are in approximate order from least expensive to most expensive.

    I am not an expert by any means. However, I had Steve (98sr20ve) and veilside180sx look these over to make sure these "Recommended Set-Ups" are solid advice. Their comments:
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    looks good to me
    Quote Originally Posted by veilside180sx
    I think you summed it up nicely and don't really see anything to change.
    Thank you gentlemen for your stamps of approval.

    Before I start buying my new suspension parts, what about all the dead OEM stuff?
    This is a standard question, I see it all the time. Here is the conversation between camarok and two very smart guys.
    Quote Originally Posted by camarok View Post
    I'm having my Nissan Mechanic get all the part numbers for OEM stuff.

    Basically I want to be able to take off my Old OEM suspension and put my new setup on ( RM and AGX ) w/o swapping ANY old parts. I should have descriptions and part numbers for anyone else who wants to do something like this.

    I know there's alot of wierd spacers and the front setup has like a 2 pieces strut mount or something weird, so in the next day or so I'll post up things and we should be good to go!

    BTW This will be for a B14 specific, don't know what swaps to a b13, I know for sure the rears will probably be different.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fosters View Post
    Here is the one for the B13: Link, so it will be helpful to the B14 guys for your list. Josh
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve View Post
    I never understood why people want to replace all the parts. Just get new bearings. Thats the only part that wears out. Have a shop pull the springs and put the new ones in if you are nervous about that part. They will do that for 20-30 bucks a pair easy. I throw the tophats away all the time when I get housing for Koni jobs and I can't remember the last time I saw a set of oem top hats I would not reuse with just some new bearings.
    However, camerok is a very thorough gentleman and wanted to replace it all. Every last bit of his suspension hardware, struts, springs, boots, bumpstops, the whole shebang. If you want to do the same for your B14, here's the thread with pictures:

    Exploded view suspension... in person - SR20 Forum

    And camerok, being incredibly helpful in his detail minded posts also gives you all the B14 part numbers and pricing:

    B13, B14, B15 Suspension Information..... - Page 9 - SR20 Forum

    There ya' go. You're now good to start planning your suspension. You can take Steve's advice or do what camerok did and replace it all. Your call, both ways have logical arguments behind them.

    BTW - If anyone does the same type of research and write-up for the B13 or B15 chassis, I would gladly add it to the thread. Thanks.

    1. Road Magnet springs and AGX struts. - This is an economical and significant upgrade over the OEM suspension. You've lost an inch of travel, but the spring rate will allow you to get away with it. Would work very well as a daily-driver and/or basic autocross suspension. Will be be a bit harsh as a daily driver if you are an old fart, if you are a youngster you'll be fine.

    Add ons: Koni bumpstops or equal, Progress RSB, FSTB, RSTB, Superpro Caster bushings, Cusco/Stillen camber plates, ES bushings, IKEA brace, upgraded wheels and tires, new dust boots, etc.

    2. Road Magnet springs and CSK struts. - Another economical way to upgrade. Stock amount of travel with the CSK's. Excellent for a daily driver and/or basic autocross suspension. Surely smooth enough for a daily driver even if you are an old fart.

    Add ons: Koni bumpstops or equal, Progress RSB, FSTB, RSTB, Superpro Caster bushings, Cusco/Stillen camber plates, ES bushings, IKEA brace, upgraded wheels and tires, new dust boots, etc.

    3. Hyperco springs and AGX struts. - This is an economical and significant upgrade over the OEM suspension. You've lost an inch of travel, but the spring rate will allow you to get away with it. Would work well as a daily-driver and/or basic autocross suspension. Should be livable as a daily driver even if you are an old fart (ed. note: I am an old fart, bad neck, bad back, etc...and I found this suspension entirely acceptable, if a bit harsh, daily-driving on war-torn Houston roads.)

    Add ons: Koni bumpstops or equal, Progress RSB, FSTB, RSTB, Superpro Caster bushings, Cusco/Stillen camber plates, ES bushings, IKEA brace, upgraded wheels and tires, new dust boots, etc.

    4. Hyperco springs and CSK struts. - An excellent way to upgrade. Stock amount of travel with the CSK's. Excellent and incredibly comfortable for a daily driver and/or excellent autocross/HPDE suspension. I have this combo on my Classic currently. It is waaaaay smoother and more comfortable than Hyperco/AGX. It might very well be more comfortable than the stock suspension. It is truly amazing ride quality. All the performance, zero downside.

    Add ons: Koni bumpstops or equal, Progress RSB, FSTB, RSTB, Superpro Caster bushings, Cusco/Stillen camber plates, ES bushings, IKEA brace, upgraded wheels and tires, new dust boots, etc.

    5. GC coilovers and AGX struts. - An economical way to upgrade. Do not lower the car more than 1.5 inches. Good for a daily driver and/or good autocross suspension. Be careful on what spring rates you choose for the GC coilovers.

    Add ons: Koni bumpstops or equal, Progress RSB, FSTB, RSTB, Superpro Caster bushings, GC camber plates, ES bushings, IKEA brace, upgraded wheels and tires, new dust boots, etc.

    6. GC coilovers and CSK struts. - A kick-ass way to upgrade. Excellent for a daily driver and/or excellent autocross/HPDE suspension. Be careful on what spring rates you choose for the GC coilovers.
    Quote Originally Posted by 98sr20ve
    Oh, BTW, I am convinced with out a doubt that the absolute best daily driver+HPDE/autocross setup is the Koni paired with GC sleeves and a real front pearch the kills 99% of any rattles (all coilovers can make some noise). Pair that with a 300-325# 10 inch front spring, GC Camber Plate. Set the rideheight to and 1.5 or so below stock That leaves you with stock levels of suspension travel. I would stack it up against anything anyone else makes in the 1200 price range.
    Add ons: Koni bumpstops or equal, Progress RSB, Ground Control camber plates, FSTB, RSTB, Superpro Caster bushings, ES bushings, IKEA brace, upgraded wheels and tires, new dust boots, etc.

    After those six (6) recommendations? You know more than me, you are after a very, very serious suspension, and you are on your own.


    XII. Discouraged Suspension Set-up

    Slamming your car as low as possible, while re-engineering it correctly.

    You insist you want to lower your car more than 1.5-inches. Yes, it can be done. You have to re-engineer parts of your suspension to make it work correctly. Move suspension pick-up points and/or modify your lower control arms. It will require welding, it will require fabrication. And you better be damn sure of what you are doing.

    Keep in mind that failure of a custom-modified suspension that was not done correctly can be dangerous to your health and safety. Do not make this type of thing your first welding project. Either be damn sure you know what you are doing, or take it to a professional. Whatever you do be safe.

    You are modifying your suspension at your own risk.


    These threads should help point you in the correct direction. Both of these gentlemen took slightly different paths to achieve their goals.

    In this following thread, I posted some links to threads by Mike Kojima on what he did to re-engineer his suspension to get his center of gravity lower for racing. Mike is an engineer who specializes in racing suspensions and consults with racing teams. Mike currently hangs his hat at MotoIQ.
    http://www.sr20-forum.com/suspension...-b13s-low.html

    Russel is a long-time forum member and very, very handy with a wrench or welder in his hands. He modified his control arms to assist him in going lower. He outlines what he did and how he did it here.
    http://www.sr20-forum.com/suspension...trol-arms.html
    Last edited by Shawn B; 10-07-12 at 08:44 PM.
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    Saved for expansion.
    Last edited by Shawn B; 01-08-08 at 12:57 AM.

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    Saved for expansion.
    Last edited by Shawn B; 01-08-08 at 12:57 AM.

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    Saved for expansion.
    Last edited by Shawn B; 01-08-08 at 12:57 AM.

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    Saved for expansion.
    Last edited by Shawn B; 01-08-08 at 12:58 AM.

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    Saved for expansion.

    Thank you bobtiji for originally moving this thread from one location to another, your efforts are appreciated. I am glad it is thought of as a valuable resource, as is its intention.

    Thank you Moderators for "Sticky'ing" this thread in this particular location, and doing a bit of clean-up work.

    Thank you to whomever did not post while I was moving this thread. The 20,000 character post limit was nowhere near big enough for the original length of these collective/individual posts. The first "warning" I got to limit my characters said "you have 66,000 characters, please limit your post to 20,000 characters." Holy crap! .......

    Gracias gentlemen, and now onward. Cutting through the fog of suspension ignorance.
    Last edited by Shawn B; 01-08-08 at 02:49 PM.

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    Car out o order since '10
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    Seems like I'm always reading this thread...lol. Lovin' the Wheels and tire section. I learned alot from that

  22. #22
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    Default Re:Shocktek

    Shocktek - Is out of business. Based on a shortened strut. Very high quality, bad-ass suspension.
    Originally Posted by Sport Compact Car July 2000
    The first part of our solution (*to limited suspension travel in the B13), stiffer, shorter shocks, came from Shocktek in Girard, Penn. Shocktek offers semi-custom shocks built to order, and has already built shocks for several SE-R's. They start with Bilstein inverted struts and re-valve and re-size them as necessary. The stock struts (supplied by you) are then modified to accept the Bilstein dampers. Shocktek can also make them adjustable by adding a tapered needle valve in the middle of the piston.

    Shocktek can build its shocks with conventional spring seats for stock or off-the-shelf lowering springs, or with threaded collars for race springs. Using threaded collars allowed us to tap into Eibach's vast catalog of race springs. The Eibach Race Spring (ERS) system covers virtually every spring rate possible in 25 lb/in increments, giving us virtually limitless suspension tuning options. (Author uncited, probably Dave Coleman).
    I *believe* that Shocktek was using the Ground Control "threaded collars for race springs."
    For SCC's B13, DC used Eibach ERS Springs, not sure about the collars - prob GC.

    They may be out of business but the July 2000 SCC article is excellent on how they first set up the B13 with custom work from Shocktek - e.g. how they arrived at the right rates, etc.

    I scanned my copy awhile ago, IMHO it's a good read, reinforces many of the excellent points in this thread. Very good section on damper rebound frequency, and IIRC a good discussion of "natural frequency" of a well dialed in chassis. The one missing link is why DC swapped these out for Progress less than 4-5 years later...guessing combo of travel and custom valving, or just out of business and needed new CO's.

    Nissan Sentra SE-R - Part V, Suspension Magic



    If the images are too small drop me a PM and I'll post links to larger scans.
    SCC Project SE-R
    '91 B13 Black, 10:1 JDM, O.E.M. CAI Intake/ JWTPopC, SSAC Header, UR Pulleys, JWT Stage 2 Clutch/ECU, Progress CO's 450F/350R, Progress F&R SWB, GC Plates, FSTB/Firewall brace, Progress LCAB, ES bushings/MM's, Wilwoods, Traklites 15x7" Kuhmo XS/Kosei K1's/NT01's, Chuck's RSTB, KOYO rad, R32 Wheel/Horn, R32 Shift knob

    Team Progress, Track Vids,My 2nd '91 B13

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    Well, I'm probably going to end up selling my car to my brother and decided that I should put my Tein Camber plates on. They fit btw....

    Haven't put the car on the ground yet, I'm wrestling with Neutral position switch, by the way when you take it off, you lose all your trans fluid :squint: .


    BTW, passenger side allen bolt heads are a little tricky to get to with the PSfluid line in the way.


    Sorry Shawn! you have more to update!!!!











    ~KEVIN
    The current
    2000 BMW 540i Sport 6 Speed
    Black on Tan
    The Ex
    The '98
    Nissan 200SX SE-R - 126k
    Red on Black

  25. #25
    bitemyshinymetalass
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    Default LCA Bushings Comapre OEM to Poly

    This is why OEM bushings are complete garbage for lack of longevity and slop:

    SCC Project SE-R
    '91 B13 Black, 10:1 JDM, O.E.M. CAI Intake/ JWTPopC, SSAC Header, UR Pulleys, JWT Stage 2 Clutch/ECU, Progress CO's 450F/350R, Progress F&R SWB, GC Plates, FSTB/Firewall brace, Progress LCAB, ES bushings/MM's, Wilwoods, Traklites 15x7" Kuhmo XS/Kosei K1's/NT01's, Chuck's RSTB, KOYO rad, R32 Wheel/Horn, R32 Shift knob

    Team Progress, Track Vids,My 2nd '91 B13

  26. #26
    Techno Viking
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    Quote Originally Posted by BenFenner View Post
    It shall be incorporated my friend.

    I have just done the first few updates on The Suspension Thread. There is a new "Preface" added at the top that explains the lengthy process.

    Quote Originally Posted by superblackz View Post
    For SCC's B13, DC used Eibach ERS Springs, not sure about the collars - prob GC.

    They may be out of business but the July 2000 SCC article is excellent on how they first set up the B13 with custom work from Shocktek - e.g. how they arrived at the right rates, etc.

    I scanned my copy awhile ago, IMHO it's a good read, reinforces many of the excellent points in this thread. Very good section on damper rebound frequency, and IIRC a good discussion of "natural frequency" of a well dialed in chassis. The one missing link is why DC swapped these out for Progress less than 4-5 years later...guessing combo of travel and custom valving, or just out of business and needed new CO's.

    If the images are too small drop me a PM and I'll post links to larger scans.
    Updates (finally) underway. As of today. It will take me a couple of months to get the Suspension Thread updated in two (2) locations.

    Quote Originally Posted by Camarok View Post
    Sorry Shawn! you have more to update!!!!
    No problems, updates in full swing.

    On this forum alone, I have "subscribed" to twenty-nine (29) threads. All of which need to be scrutinized, categorized, and incorporated.

    Quote Originally Posted by superblackz View Post
    This is why OEM bushings are complete garbage for lack of longevity and slop:

    I not only will incorporate that, but I *think* I have subscribed to other threads of yours, or maybe you posted in the Suspension Thread on the other forum (?).

    It is a long, methodical, tedious process to update The Suspension Thread. If you were to print it out, the damn thread comes to eighty-one (81) pages!

    Thank you all for you input and contributions.

    Updates are currently in the works, gentlemen.

    Shawn B
    Last edited by Shawn B; 11-29-08 at 07:03 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wifey
    You are a verbal mercenary, honey.
    Deeply disturbed in Louisiana.

  27. #27
    Offensive.
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn B View Post
    If you were to print it out, the damn thread comes to eighty-one (81) pages!
    And I have done just that! I can't stand reading long articles online, I prefer a hard copy if I can.
    '05 Legacy GT Wagon - Wheezing.
    '03 Forester X Wagon - De-stancing the Daily.
    '99 SE-L - Resuscitation Complete. Project Beater.
    SR20DEEP WI

  28. #28
    Techno Viking
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    Quote Originally Posted by xCONWRATHx View Post
    And I have done just that! I can't stand reading long articles online, I prefer a hard copy if I can.
    You'e hard-core dude!

    You can then decide when you want to print yourself a Version 2.0. I would suggest you wait till at least post-February 2009.

    I only figured the page-count out recently, when I was printing out just one page of the thread, hit the wrong button and then had to hit "cancel" right quick. No, I did not want eighty-one pages.

    What length manuscript officially qualifies as a "book"? ............
    Quote Originally Posted by Wifey
    You are a verbal mercenary, honey.
    Deeply disturbed in Louisiana.

  29. #29
    The Little SE-R Guy
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    Default Shawn B

    I hate to be a bother I remember us discussing megan coilovers for the B13 on the other forum and noticed that they haven't been added to the suspension thread and it was just updated. If you would like more info on them there are a few people running them on the forum.

    I have also noticed it looks like B+G seems to be coming back out with suspension parts for our cars

    Here is a link:
    http://http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BG-ADJUSABLE-COILOVER-NISSAN-SENTRA-B13-N14-341-N15_W0QQitemZ270367522423QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors _Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item270367522423 &_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171|65%3A12 |39%3A1|240%3A1318
    Last edited by Jimithin7000; 04-15-09 at 10:20 AM. Reason: Adding BG coilovers
    JimmiSPEC

    Need parts? PM me!
    SR20DEEP CT

    Quote Originally Posted by Ulysses View Post
    You are the Chuck Norris of sentras.

  30. #30
    This will not end well
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    Default

    Can you combine the updates to this one to the one on Sr20forum? Its last update was 1/18/08
    1992 NX2000 - GTX28 - RS6
    Coming soon - Hardtop NX2000 - Roller rocker


  31. #31
    The People's Mod
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BenFenner View Post
    There's an update to this thread. Basically I was wrong about how bad the ES bushings in the rear were. The real lesson was not to over tighten the suspension. PM me if you want to talk about what (if anything) is useful from my experience for your thread.

  32. #32
    Techno Viking
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    Default

    Updates are underway right now gentlemen.

    1) Overkill Engineering - done multiple times in about five different places. Awesomeness.

    2) BenFenner - Suspension Bind thread, included in the correct spot.

    3) Definition of LSD's seriously updated and completed.

    4) Foamsealing thread, OEM strut mount studs thread.

    5) Re-did many of the size and boldness fonts to make it easier to follow and read.

    6) I also updated the other forums (SR20Forum) Suspension Thread, via "cut n paste", as of 07/07/2009. I will update it once again, when I am fully done updating this forums Suspension Thread.

    More to come over the next couple of weeks. All concerns and suggested additions shall be incorporated.

    Thank you for all your input.

    Shawn B
    Last edited by Shawn B; 07-09-09 at 02:37 PM. Reason: Updated my updates.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wifey
    You are a verbal mercenary, honey.
    Deeply disturbed in Louisiana.

  33. #33
    old and dirty.. and dirty
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    I uh, am not clear about using yellow koni's on a B13...

    I think you have to purchase B15 yellow koni's and a strut housing from another car, like maybe an A32 Maxima (1989-1994 Maxima)... right? and then shorten the maxima strut housing??

    I want the adjustability of the yellows without having to uninstall the struts like on the reds....

    anyone?

    anyone?

    Bueller?
    1991 | black | SE-R
    RE-11's | hypercoil | CSKs | F&R sways | octotat RSTB | jk nismotronic rt ecu

    SR20DEEP MidWest Chapter

  34. #34
    Techno Viking
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    Quote Originally Posted by vqman View Post
    I uh, am not clear about using yellow koni's on a B13...

    I think you have to purchase B15 yellow koni's and a strut housing from another car, like maybe an A32 Maxima (1989-1994 Maxima)... right? and then shorten the maxima strut housing??

    I want the adjustability of the yellows without having to uninstall the struts like on the reds....

    anyone?

    anyone?

    Bueller?
    I wish I could help. I get totally and completely confused by the various Koni options. Somebody with expertise is going to build me a set...this spring.

    You could re-read Steves (98sr20ve) thread on the subject, it may clarify for you. Or you could bump his thread and ask your specific question.

    Folks like Wes (Steve, Mike K, etc...) or the dudes at Overkill Engineering will know the correct answer for sure.

    I don't know if that helps or not.

    Shawn B
    Quote Originally Posted by Wifey
    You are a verbal mercenary, honey.
    Deeply disturbed in Louisiana.

  35. #35
    Member
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    I used b14 monroe sensatrac housings w/ b15 koni yellows.
    i'm running 450 lbs in front and 400 in the rears.
    i dunno anything about shortening the strut, basically, your lopping off the top where the stock spring perch sits and drilling a hole in the bottom of the housing, slipping the koni cartridge in and bolting it down.
    no rocket science there.
    i hope that helps

  36. #36
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    *edit* the way I explained about is if your using coilovers.
    if you plan to use springs, the job is even easier!

    i had the maxima inserts before. I believe you can only use them w/ maxima housings since the diameter is much larger. I think those kill the spec v inserts.

  37. #37
    The Ninja Lawnmower
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vqman View Post
    I uh, am not clear about using yellow koni's on a B13...

    I think you have to purchase B15 yellow koni's and a strut housing from another car, like maybe an A32 Maxima (1989-1994 Maxima)... right? and then shorten the maxima strut housing??

    I want the adjustability of the yellows without having to uninstall the struts like on the reds....

    anyone?

    anyone?

    Bueller?
    I am running Yellows in the front and reds in the back, in combo with my hypercos. Way back when, Steve tried to get the yellows to work in the back with the OEM b13 housing, but he said he couldn't (I forget why, like I was going to contest it!). So I have my yellows in the front (it did require some spacers/washers under the top nut to fit correctly) and the reds in the rear.
    So, yellows fit in the front with the OEM b13 housing, but you'll need something else to make them fit in the rear.
    Vitamin B13: Cures all of your ills. Doseage is 7500rpm. Repeat as necessary.
    Making the asphalt in the corners beg for mercy since 1997.

  38. #38
    old and dirty.. and dirty
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isfahan View Post
    I am running Yellows in the front and reds in the back, in combo with my hypercos. Way back when, Steve tried to get the yellows to work in the back with the OEM b13 housing, but he said he couldn't (I forget why, like I was going to contest it!). So I have my yellows in the front (it did require some spacers/washers under the top nut to fit correctly) and the reds in the rear.
    So, yellows fit in the front with the OEM b13 housing, but you'll need something else to make them fit in the rear.
    thanks! and for clarity, those are B15 yellows in front the OEM B13 housing, right?
    1991 | black | SE-R
    RE-11's | hypercoil | CSKs | F&R sways | octotat RSTB | jk nismotronic rt ecu

    SR20DEEP MidWest Chapter

  39. #39
    The Ninja Lawnmower
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    Yes, I am pretty sure they were SpecV B15 yellows (I never saw them in the box, and it was a couple of years ago now) in OEM B13 housings.
    Vitamin B13: Cures all of your ills. Doseage is 7500rpm. Repeat as necessary.
    Making the asphalt in the corners beg for mercy since 1997.

  40. #40
    old and dirty.. and dirty
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isfahan View Post
    Yes, I am pretty sure they were SpecV B15 yellows (I never saw them in the box, and it was a couple of years ago now) in OEM B13 housings.
    all right, now we just need to get someone to tell us what rear strut housings to use...

    and Shawn could probably add this info to the thread in the struts/springs portion..
    1991 | black | SE-R
    RE-11's | hypercoil | CSKs | F&R sways | octotat RSTB | jk nismotronic rt ecu

    SR20DEEP MidWest Chapter

 

 
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