Welcome to the SR20 Community Forum - The Dash.
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 40 of 71
  1. #1
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default Trouble setting timing.

    So ive done some research and am still having trouble resetting the timing on my RR. ive i have the motor and TDC, with the intake cam gear at 10 o'clock and the exhaust at 12 o'clock with 20 rollers inbetween. but when i tried to start up the motor just a bit ago there was a nasty metal clickin noise, almost as if the chain skipped a tooth, but i check and there is still 20 links between the marks on the cam gears. I just replaced timing chain tensioner as well as a UR crank pulley

    i also noticed that at TDC i have a lot of slack on the timing chain. only a TDC tho, throughout the rest of the rotation the chain is pretty snug.
    im trying to get this done this weekend cuz i need my DD to get to school so plz any info will help

    any suggestions? heres some pics to show where im sitting at now. thanks!




    Last edited by bmexicang; 12-09-12 at 01:55 AM.

  2. #2
    The B14 says: PPPSsSSHH
    User Info
    Join Date: Aug 2008
    Location: DFW, TX
    Posts: 393
    Feedback Score: 5 (100%)

    Default

    Make sure that the tdc mark on pulley is tdc many pulleys separate and the timing marks can be as much as a 1/4 revolution off. Just stick a long extension down the plug hole as you rotate to check.

  3. #3
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    i did do this, placed a long screw driver in the spark plug hole. i will check if TDC with the screw driver matched TDC with the 2nd mark on the pulley
    Last edited by bmexicang; 12-09-12 at 12:21 PM.

  4. #4
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    morning bump

  5. #5
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Oct 2012
    Location: aussie
    Posts: 664
    Feedback Score: 2 (100%)

    Default

    Pulsar Group of Australia


    http://www.sr20forum.com/gallery/dat...ley_resize.JPG
    have you got the links right? count is 5,21,9. sure you ain't got 5,20,10? (exhaust out 1 tooth).i had this after a cam install.motor would run (just) but sounded terrible.
    Last edited by sss4me; 12-09-12 at 03:41 PM.

  6. #6
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    i read on other threads that it was 20 chain links between the cam gear markings...
    but i see this image goes by the teeth so il try that...it litereally feels like one tooth makes the chain much more firm so hopefully this is the issue...

    any other ideas? i dont see any wear marks on the cam gears or the chain.

  7. #7
    additcted to boost
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: the river
    Posts: 1,430
    Feedback Score: 3 (100%)

    Default

    Make sure when you set the timing you leave the slack from the chain on the tensioner side , release the tensioner and spin the motor over by hand a few times you should be good to go.
    SR20DEEP,MARSH TUNING
    94 Se-r vq35 daily
    94 ser 67mm turbo car

  8. #8
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    Just got it started making a weird clacking noise. Most likely a tooth off?

  9. #9
    Oh well....
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2012
    Location: Philly Burbs
    Posts: 6,574
    Feedback Score: 46 (98%)

    Default

    The first pic looks like the tensioner has not engaged.. The slack that is, reminds me of how it would look
    Jordan
    '98 SE-R, '12 Versa Hatch & '14 Juke Turbo
    Music - - My SR20 website

  10. #10
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Oct 2012
    Location: aussie
    Posts: 664
    Feedback Score: 2 (100%)

    Default

    1 tooth=1 link. 5-21-9.gospel.

  11. #11
    additcted to boost
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: the river
    Posts: 1,430
    Feedback Score: 3 (100%)

    Default

    Clacking noise sounds to me like the chain is slapping around like the tensioner is junk.
    SR20DEEP,MARSH TUNING
    94 Se-r vq35 daily
    94 ser 67mm turbo car

  12. #12
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jun 2009
    Location: North Boston MA
    Posts: 1,434
    Feedback Score: 11 (100%)

    Default

    Or ur lifters are not primed. And yes the slack should be on tension side

  13. #13
    THE SE- RLOGIST
    User Info
    Join Date: Mar 2009
    Location: Boston Ma
    Posts: 3,141
    Feedback Score: 25 (100%)

    Default

    project car and school does not mix well never did.

  14. #14
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    So I got the car running. Was running fine. but after driving about 20 miles on the freeway this clacking noise began sounded like it was coming from cylinder 2 or 3. Any ideas?

    Before I Replaced tensioner and did timing there Was some side to side play on a few of the rocker arms, Time to replace them? But when I pushed down on the hydraulic lifters there was No movement on any of the Lifters... Car has 165k miles
    Last edited by bmexicang; 12-10-12 at 01:06 AM.

  15. #15
    Big kid with gray hair
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Pennsylvania
    Posts: 1,548
    Feedback Score: 5 (100%)

    Default

    Was the tensioner engaged in the above pictures?

    The rockers moved with the cams tightened down?
    S62...huh?

  16. #16
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    yes the tensioner was engaged, the issue i was having is that i was setting the timing marks but the slack was staying inbetween the cam gears, so i put a socket on the intake cam and rotated counterclockwise to move the slack to the tensioner side

    the rockers moved side to side with the cams and old tensioner in. it was like literally 1mm of side to side movement 2 rockers on the intake side and 1 on the exhaust side

  17. #17
    Oh well....
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2012
    Location: Philly Burbs
    Posts: 6,574
    Feedback Score: 46 (98%)

    Default

    See the phrase under my screen name. They really are a pain
    Jordan
    '98 SE-R, '12 Versa Hatch & '14 Juke Turbo
    Music - - My SR20 website

  18. #18
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    here is a video of the sound that started after about 20 mins of driving. it seems to get much louder when i use the accelerator.


  19. #19
    Big kid with gray hair
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Pennsylvania
    Posts: 1,548
    Feedback Score: 5 (100%)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmexicang View Post
    yes the tensioner was engaged, the issue i was having is that i was setting the timing marks but the slack was staying inbetween the cam gears, so i put a socket on the intake cam and rotated counterclockwise to move the slack to the tensioner side

    the rockers moved side to side with the cams and old tensioner in. it was like literally 1mm of side to side movement 2 rockers on the intake side and 1 on the exhaust side
    Was there that much slack when you initially popped the valve cover? The tensioner should take that up. If you still have that much slack after rotating the motor clockwise (by hand), your tensioner is shot or not engaged.

    With the cams out, the rockers will move that much. They just float on top of the guide/shim/top of the HLA. With the cams in, it should be a lot harder to move them, if at all. If the HLA's are still solid, I'd get a feeler gauge and check the lash clearence. With that many miles, the rockers could be at the end of their life. The lobes on the cams are probably semi worn, as well.
    Last edited by hammerin hank; 12-10-12 at 05:49 PM.
    S62...huh?

  20. #20
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Apr 2011
    Location: Bolingbrook, IL
    Posts: 155
    Feedback Score: 2 (100%)

    Default

    The tensioner presses against the timing chain guide which pivots off a point towards the bottom of the motor. If you pull off your tensioner and it springs back after being compressed, and it is hard to push back in, that guide behind the oil pump cover could have cracked, and that's why you are not getting tension on the chain itself.

  21. #21
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    i got tension on the chain, its super snug now definitely made a big difference replacing tensioner.

    now i am on the issue that i am getting from under the valve cover, doesn't sound like the timing chain, but more like a rocker? not to sure, posted up a video

  22. #22
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    I left 20 rollers between the can gear timing marks which is What the fsm specified for,but I keep reading 21 is the right number. Any one care to verify?

  23. #23
    Big kid with gray hair
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Pennsylvania
    Posts: 1,548
    Feedback Score: 5 (100%)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmexicang View Post
    I left 20 rollers between the can gear timing marks which is What the fsm specified for,but I keep reading 21 is the right number. Any one care to verify?
    Definitely, 20.

    Intake keyway @ 10 o'clock, exhaust keyway @ 12 o'clock
    #1 cylinder @ TDC and you should be timed correctly.

    Also make sure there is no slack between the exhaust gear and the crank gear. That could screw things up.

    Kyle's writeup from our "how to" section: HOW TO: Check camshaft timing
    Last edited by hammerin hank; 12-10-12 at 10:47 PM.
    S62...huh?

  24. #24
    Big kid with gray hair
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Pennsylvania
    Posts: 1,548
    Feedback Score: 5 (100%)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmexicang View Post
    i got tension on the chain, its super snug now definitely made a big difference replacing tensioner.

    now i am on the issue that i am getting from under the valve cover, doesn't sound like the timing chain, but more like a rocker? not to sure, posted up a video
    Check that all of the guides and shims are there and the rockers are seated correctly.
    S62...huh?

  25. #25
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    thanks guys il definitely check the timing again, its making this horrible knocking sound and i keep getting a kocking code pending immediately after clearing it.

    i havent read anything about the rockers being seated so i will look into that.

    BTW this forum is awesome, i get much more motor help on here than on the G20 site. ha
    Last edited by bmexicang; 12-10-12 at 11:54 PM.

  26. #26
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    i had a chance to take off the valve cover earlier, the shims and guides were all there and i didnt see any of them with damage, but there are still a few of the rockers that allow side to side movment. intake side on cylinder # 1,2,3 and exhaust side on cylinder #2,3 could it be that it was having this issue before, but now that i have a new tensioner and the chain is fully tensioner i am getting much more noise?

  27. #27
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Apr 2011
    Location: Bolingbrook, IL
    Posts: 155
    Feedback Score: 2 (100%)

    Default

    If the noise is consistent regardless of the RPM, you can usually draw the noise back to something in the valvetrain. If the noise is intermittent and only comes up during certain RPM ranges, you could still have cracked guides, and a chain that is slapping around with variances in the tension.

  28. #28
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    it stays pretty quiet at idle but around 2k rps to 4k its the loudest..also its loudest on the lower gears and when im giving it throttle.

    its weird though because i wasnt having this issue before i put in the new tensioner..but i also did reset the timing chain because it got knocked off a tooth by accident when i had the VC off

  29. #29
    Oh well....
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2012
    Location: Philly Burbs
    Posts: 6,574
    Feedback Score: 46 (98%)

    Default

    Watched the video. That is a strange sound, reminds me almost of a transmission whine.. Of course that's not it, but its def not normal. At first it just sounds like a noisy valve train
    Last edited by Storm88000; 12-11-12 at 06:49 PM.
    Jordan
    '98 SE-R, '12 Versa Hatch & '14 Juke Turbo
    Music - - My SR20 website

  30. #30
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    right...i find it off..il take another video today on my way to school

  31. #31
    Oh well....
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2012
    Location: Philly Burbs
    Posts: 6,574
    Feedback Score: 46 (98%)

    Default

    So it drives ok other than the noise? What about at WOT?
    Jordan
    '98 SE-R, '12 Versa Hatch & '14 Juke Turbo
    Music - - My SR20 website

  32. #32
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    here a video of me driving the vehicle..kinda starting to think that it might be the timing chain. thinking about doing the timing again. now that i have a little more knowledge on the procedure.


  33. #33
    additcted to boost
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: the river
    Posts: 1,430
    Feedback Score: 3 (100%)

    Default

    Do me a favor take the valve cover off and take the little plate that is directly over the timing chain in between the two cams. Put the valve cover back on and see if it still makes the noise if so the tension on the chain might still be weak.
    SR20DEEP,MARSH TUNING
    94 Se-r vq35 daily
    94 ser 67mm turbo car

  34. #34
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    I actually never had that timing chain guide. I don't think RRs came with them

  35. #35
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Storm88000 View Post
    So it drives ok other than the noise? What about at WOT?
    At WOT it is Still there but It is definitely very throaty very loud for having a stock intake box

  36. #36
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Oct 2012
    Location: aussie
    Posts: 664
    Feedback Score: 2 (100%)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmexicang View Post
    I left 20 rollers between the can gear timing marks which is What the fsm specified for,but I keep reading 21 is the right number. Any one care to verify?
    amuse me.put the motor to tdc.forget the amount of chain links between the cam gears.using the second diagram i gave you (which is actually a tomei diagram) count the teeth down on either side from the holes in the cam gears.if you ain't got 5 on the intake,and 9 on the exhaust,then its out.i'll bet you got 10 on the exhaust if you have only got 20 links between the gears...

    here's a vid of a bloke in aus's motor who had the exact same problem.


    why's the idle so high? timing's at? is one of you cv's f*%ked?
    now i dug up this,count teeth (not links) between the two red lines,including the two red lines.there are 21.count teeth,not links.links will confuse you...count 5,21,9.
    http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...paintmarks.jpg
    Last edited by sss4me; 12-12-12 at 06:18 AM.

  37. #37
    Big kid with gray hair
    User Info
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: Pennsylvania
    Posts: 1,548
    Feedback Score: 5 (100%)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sss4me View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by bmexicang View Post
    I left 20 rollers between the can gear timing marks which is What the fsm specified for,but I keep reading 21 is the right number. Any one care to verify?
    amuse me.put the motor to tdc.forget the amount of chain links between the cam gears.using the second diagram i gave you (which is actually a tomei diagram) count the teeth down on either side from the holes in the cam gears.if you ain't got 5 on the intake,and 9 on the exhaust,then its out.i'll bet you got 10 on the exhaust if you have only got 20 links between the gears...
    I'm really not sure why you're making this more difficult than it needs to be. If the crank gear is in the right postion (TDC) and the exhaust cam gear is in the right position (cam key @ 12 o'clock) and there's 20 pins between the exhaust gear mark and the intake gear mark and there's no slack between the crank gear and the exhaust gear, the cam timing is correct. Any other numbers or counting beyond that is extraneous and confusing to others.
    Last edited by hammerin hank; 12-12-12 at 02:29 PM.
    Likes B15NEOVVL Liked this post
     
    S62...huh?

  38. #38
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    im gonna open her up today i have the afternoon off and tomorrow off so il have a decent amount of time to take a look. i cant take the noise anymore.

  39. #39
    Oh well....
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2012
    Location: Philly Burbs
    Posts: 6,574
    Feedback Score: 46 (98%)

    Default

    Just watched the 2nd vid of you driving.. And with that sound, i think I'm going to suggest you don't drive it anymore until we get this figured out. It almost sounds like heavy valve tapping due to oil starvation up top.. But you said it was fine before this, so unless its a coincidence that your motor went south at the same time (which is unlikely but I have seen these types of things before) it's def not running even close to correctly, it sounds like its about to blow up. I'm not sure if cam timing would cause this sound, as I've seen SR20s which were off a tooth or two after a cam swap not even start up, or if they did, start up and stall within like 4 seconds.

    I'm not trying to scare you but that sound sure scares me. How did everything look up top in terms of any oil sludge, dark stuff etc? Has the oil been changed regularly?
    While Its prob due to the demographic who were more likely to own the Infiniti G20 back when it was new (owners were possibly a bit older and less likely to hit the rev limiter on a regular basis, which is actually healthy for the SR20) - I ask because we have seen a lot of G20's over the years with these types of issues, usually automatics that were driven very softly and suffered from oil starvation and/or were poorly maintained. (I knew a guy who bought a G20 from an older woman where the service records indicated she went over 14k between oil changes at times in 8 years of ownership)

    Your motor does not have the timing chain guide installed, correct? I think Nissan ditched them in the SR20 after 1997, they did no good at all and actually could damage the timing chain over time, not to mention the noises. I remove them everytime I get my hands on another SE-R.

    It sure could be and probably is the timing, I'm just surprised it even runs.
    Last edited by Storm88000; 12-13-12 at 12:49 AM.
    Jordan
    '98 SE-R, '12 Versa Hatch & '14 Juke Turbo
    Music - - My SR20 website

  40. #40
    Member
    User Info
    Join Date: Jan 2008
    Location: Oceanside
    Posts: 430
    Feedback Score: 4 (100%)

    Default

    here is some more videos that show how i have the car sitting at the moment with regard to the timing and with regard to the rockers

    TIMING

    ROCKERS

    thanks again guys for all the help.

 

 
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Back to top